Encounter over Denmark

[Stephen Smith]

On the 17/18th May 1942 a enemy fighter attacked Sergeant Medus and crew on the return flight from the “Rosemary” mining area. Stirling N6072 HA-J was damaged but returned to base, the reargunner returned fire and claimed a "damaged"

Is there any German records that record this encounter.?

Regards

Steve

[Soren Flensted]

Steve
Where is the "Rosemary" mining area located ?

[Ex Shack]

Hi
Look at http://www.bombercrew.com/Mining/WestDenmark.htm and it shows that the Rosemary areas, 5 in all, were off the W Coast of Schleswig-Holstein. Technically they were off German territory as the German-Danish border is shown as coming offshore at an angle that makes the sea area German.
Regards
Dick

[Chris Goss]

There were a number of aircraft lost Gardening that night (7) of which 4 were due to Flak, 2 unknown, one in an accident. Hptm Hans-Georg Schütze of 4/NJG 2 claimed a Wellington NE of Pellworm at 0049 hrs and Oblt Rudolf Schönert of the same unit a Stirling NE Leeuwaarden at 0054 hrs. The former then crashed near Pellworm with the deaths of he and his crew. There is no record of any ac damaged so either Schütze was shot down by whom he shot down (possibly X3644/115 Sqn) or by some other cause.

[Stephen Smith]

Hi Chris,

No.218 Squadron lost Short Stirling N6071 HA-G flown by F/Lt Arthur Humphreys DFC & crew on this night. This loss I think is down to Oberleutant Rudolf Schonert 4./NJG2. F/Lt Humphreys was on his 27th operation when made POW. The crews mining area was Daffodil I. Sergeant Medus was allotted Rosemary II. There is some confliction between the squadron ORB 540 & 541. One suggest the e/a was damaged, the other states the e/a broke-off when engaged, no results seen. ?

[Chris Goss]

Stephen: According to Chorley, the 218 Sqn ac was lost to Flak. There were no damaged nightfighters that night-maybe another optimistic claim?

[Stephen Smith]

Hi Chris,

I have a copy of the WO files for the pilot & gunner, both claim a Nighfighter was the cause. I think the confussion starts with the Loss Card, this suggests that the Aussie Observer F/O Barnfather died from stomach wounds "caused" by flak while decending by parachute. ! The aircraft came down in a isolated area, from my own research I believe he was wounded in the encounter, managed to bail out only to die of his wounds.

Steve

[Chris Goss]

Is Lyne 15 kms NE of Leeuwaarden though? The combat location looks as if it was some way from Denmark

[Stephen Smith]

Chris,

N6071 crashed near Lyne at approx 00.57hr, I think it is safe to say the victim of a N/F. I also believe the victim of Oblt Rudolf Schöner. Two WO Reports confirm that a "Nightfighter" was the cause, there is no mention of flak, another factor to consider is that Sgt George Toynbee-Clarke(AG) required medical treatment for bullet wounds to his head and upper shoulder, which required the attention of Dr R.Nielson.

Regarding Sgt Medus, there is confliction regarding the encounter, the AM Form 540 / 541 differ in that one suggest that the n/f was damaged, the other reports that it broke off when the reargunner opened fire.

Regards

Steve

[Chris Goss]

Steve: All I am saying is Schönert's victim was apparently shot down 15 kms NE of Leeuwaarden which by my estimate is quite some distance from Lyne. Digging deeper, a 418 Sqn Boston (W8318) went missing on an intruder to Leeuwarden that night & crashed at Akkerwoude 15 kms NE of Leeuwarden at 0057 hrs. Strange-looks like the German did get a victim but it was not a Stirling which begs the question who or what shot down the Stirling at Lyne. German records thought the Boston was damaged by Flak over Germany and then crashed in Holland

[Soren Flensted]

Hello
Regarding N6071 crashed near Lyne , see:

http://www.flensted.eu.com/194224.shtml

References are found at the buttom of the page.

[Chris Goss]

I stand corrected! It would appear that German records are incorrect saying '15 kms NE Leeuwaarden'-presume the Flugbuch is more specific?

[Soren Flensted]

Hi Chris
The Hans Richter Flugbuch reads:
493. Schoenert. Richter. Bf 110. R4+BM. Nachtjagd. Westerland. 18.5.42. 00:05. Westerland. 18.5. 02:10. 125`.
The Hans Richter Abschussbeteiligungen reads:
24. Oblt Schoenert. 18.5.42. 00:54. Short Stirling b. Westerland (Aufschl. i. Dänemark).

[Soren Flensted]

Hi Steve
Regarding Barnfather, the Danish police report reads:
At approx. 06:00 a death flyer was found west of Ringkobing road, approx. 850 meters from the crashsite. The parachute had been deployed, but when the flyer hit the ground he had made a ½ meter deep imprint in the soil.

This indicates to me that Barnfather had experienced a so called candle or streamer (chute not deploying properly) or that he had bailed out a too low level.
Since he was found only 850 meters from the wreckage, I find the latter the most probable.

[Chris Goss]

Thanks Soren

[Stephen Smith]

Dear Soren,

Thank you for the additional information, always welcome old friend.

Regards

Steve