He 219 V23 DV+DI found at Hörsching?

[Roger Gaemperle]

Hello,

Can anybody confirm that He 219 V23 DV+DI was found at Hörsching at the end of the war? This is the aircraft used for ejection seat trials at Rechlin.

Regards,
Roger Gaemperle

[edNorth]

He 219 V17 PK+QJ was found at Hörsching. I don know of V23.

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?aircraft_genericsearch=&airlinesearch=&countrysearch=&specialsearch=&daterange=&keywords=He+219&range=&sort_order=datestamp+desc&page_limit=15&thumbnails=

[Roger Gaemperle]

Hello Ed,

That's exactly the one I was looking for! I wasn't sure which He 219 was found at Hoersching, I only knew that it didn't have any antennas on its nose like V23. But V17 is the correct one. Thank you very much.

Kind regards
Roger

[barkas]

Hallo, photo from Horsching is great!
Are you sure that prototyp He-219V23 had "stamm" DV+DI??
DV+DI (190113) and DV+DL (190116) were prototyps for ejection seat trials (source: He-219 Flugzeug Profile 10)

This maschine on a few photograph marked V23 and DV+D_ (last letter unread) was found after war on Cheb (Eger) factory airfield (Czech)between wrack of other three He-219s (WNr. (190)222, (190)179 and (190)188.

Any other informations??

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello

He219A-0 (Werkenr. 190113, DV+DI) was given Versuchsnummer V-17 and this nightfighter was the second He219 used as testbed for the ejection seat.

He219A-0 (Werkenr. 190116, DV+DL) was never used as testbed and was flown by the I./NJG 1 and then II./NJG 1. The last unit lost this aircraft on 19th May 1944.

He219A-0 (Werkenr. 190121, DV+DQ) was initially used as Versuchsmuster V-32 but since end August 1944 used for the testprogram of Versuchsmuster V-23.

Best regards, Marcel

[Kaiyan]

Hi, Don't know if this is of any use came across it looking into the pilot... regards

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello,

Thanks! I know the pictures and have his flight log as well :)

Regards, Marcel

[he219research]

Dear barkas,
I have some conflicting information regarding the Uhu’s found at Eger/Cheb: in my list the He 219 found there were the following:

Werkenr. 190121 (DV+DQ, A-0)
Werkenr. 190223 (BE+JU, A-0)
Werkenr. 310188 (unknown, A-7)
Werkenr. 190129 (GU+BE, A-0) (uncertain if this A/C was found at Eger/Cheb)

I have Werkenr. 190222 listed as crashed on 15/6 ´44 at Judenatt (40km northwest of Schwechat).

Werkenr. 190179 was found at Lechfeld in May ´45 together with 190104 and 190176.

Werkenr. 190188 was shot down 4/6 ´44 by Mosquito (219 Sqn RAF) north of Wilhelminadorp (in the Netherlands).


Dear Marcel,
Can you confirm that Werkenr. 190113 was given Versuchsnummer V-17?
I have 190113 listed as V19 for ejection seat tests, and Werkenr. 190060 as V17 (testbed for BMW003 jet engine, and later DB603AA).

Best regards,
Ingemar C.

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello

My apologies for the error that 190113 had V-17, this was 190060 indeed. However, 190113 certainly did not get V-19 because this Versuchsnummer was reserved for a He219 with a pressurized cabin. In June 1944 another He219 was assigned for the V-19 testprogram but it was cancelled. In a list of Versuchsmuster from January 1945, V-19 is no longer referred to.

About the He219's found at Eger/Cheb: it is not definitely clear whether the numbers 188, 223 etc. were (abbreviated) Werkenummer or works internal numbers. He219 (310188) was found at Westerland/Sylt, whereas 190188 crashed near Wilhelminadorp/Netherlands as you have written correctly.

He219 (190222) did not crash at Judenatt but Judenau

Best regards, Marcel

[Kaiyan]

REF post No.7

Hi,
I came across this guy while looking into the Ju.390v-2 stories his flight log is supposed to document flights of this aircraft at Riechlin (sorry spelling wrong). I posted all that stuff on LEMB believe its all still there.
regards

[he219research]

Thanks for clearing this up, Marcel (especially regarding the fate and final location of Werkenr. 310188).

Regarding the V-19: the reason to believe this was the 190113 is mostly based on the telex message of 24 Feb. ´44 from Heinkel Vienna to the RLM that advises the He 219 A-042 (Werkenr. 190113) to be earmarked for a Versuchs-role, although with no particular V-number assigned. (source: "He 219 Research Paper, 3rd Ed. " by Francis Ferguson).

The only He 219 I can find a reference to with a pressurized cabin is Werkenr. 190073 (RL+AM). Could this perhaps be the other candidate for the designation V-19, if 190113 is ruled out?

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello,

190113 was indeed used as a Versuchsmuster (V-number not known yet) for ejection seat trials soon after February 1944 and when these tests were completed, 190113 was used again for another project.

I faintly remember to have read about a plan to use 190073 for a pressurized cockpit, but it was never effected. All 6 documents I have with 190073 refer to a normal use as a nightfighter with the I./NJG 1 in Venlo, my hometown. It went down in April 1944, the first successful ejection of a crew under combat conditions.

Best regards, Marcel

[Martin388]

Since the publication of Schwechat a photograph in Klassiker.d.Lf.7/17 there is a new mystery about V23.

While there are evidence pictures that the plane was in Cheb/Eger at the end of hostilities in Europe 1945, its tail was found in Vienna by British visitors to the Schwechat airbase.

I assume that its tail unit has been exchanged, a common procedere also with He162 which makes WNr research much more difficult.

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Martin,

I have a source containing a comment for V-23 which reads 'Flugzeug wird aufgeteilt' which could explain why parts have been found at Schwechat and Cheb/Eger.

Best regards, Marcel

[Martin388]

Hello Marcel,

We share the source you mention and it is dated end of 1944/beginning 1945.
So it was planned by the Luftwaffe to dissassemle the plane at that time.

However the fact that this plane (at least its fuselage with 'V23' (only) on the front end) was found at Cheb/Eger at the end of the war (April/May 1945) shows that the plan has not been followed or the fuselage was reassembled with other parts. And the plane was (later) transfered to Cheb/Eger - for what reason?

BTW, Cheb/Eger (FWE) was used for repair/rebuilding He219/177 by Heinkel and or finally to convert Messerschmitt 262A-1/U3/A-4 recce planes, as is a well researched fact by JaPo Publications.

This mentioned dissassembly migth be true (only) for the tail unit, as the tail was found at Schwechat after war's end by evidence (without any doubt) of a British post war photo from Schwechat.

The British visited Schechat mid 1945 in search of a airport close to Vienna for their use civil/Administration and Military Transport use. They choose Schwechat albait its largely devasted condition and shared it with the French Forces, whereas the US took over Tulln/Langenlebarn, an the Soviet Forces used Bad Vöslau.

So the question remains, for what reason was V23 transfered to Cheb/Eger in spring 1945?

Best regards, Martin

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Martin,

The source is dated 24-1-1945 and shows what was planned at that time. The photo's made at Eger/Cheb were most likely made after the liberation of that area.
Multiple sources (ranging from Febr.1944 to half June 1944) reveal however that He219 DV+DQ was used for the V-32 test program (2e Mustermaschine, GM-1). Therefore my first thought (just hypothetical) is that when the V-32 program finished, DV+DQ was appointed to become V-23.

If I am correct, then DV+DQ replaced the original V-23 (Wnr.190113) which was flown to Schwechat early May 1944 to get the second 3-men cockpit (190112 was the first He219 with a 3-men cockpit).

As we all can see, the V-23 in Cheb/Eger shows that DV+DQ had a two seats cockpit. Some scenario's: 1) the 3-men configuration for the V-23 program had been dropped (photo's in Cheb show a twoseats cockpit) 2) the plan to adapt this He219 for the Jumo222 was never put in action too 3) the Original requirements for the V-23 program had been dropped.

Best regards, Marcel

[Marcel Hogenhuis]

Hello Martin,

Would love to hear your comment(s) about my thoughts in my previous reply.

Best regards, Marcel