View Full Version : 5J+ER (7/KG4) downed 27 Oct 1940

James Farrimond
24th October 2013, 11:17

Can anyone supply me with any additional information about Ju88 A-5 5J+ER, Wnr. 6129 (7./KG4), shot down over Linton-Upon-Ouse on 27th October 1940?

Specifically looking for the AI(g) crash report and its corresponding AI(k) interrogation report if available? Believe the pilot was Oberlt. Podbielski, captured unhurt.



Matti Salonen
24th October 2013, 11:52
1940-10-27, 7./KG 30, Ju 88A-5, (88)6129, 5J+ER, Duggleby, 10 km südöstlich Malton, Yorkshire, Bauchlandung infolge Flakbeschuß. Bruch 100 %.
Flugzeugführer (Staffelführer) Olt Podbielski, Friedrich, gefangen
Beobachter Fw Heier, Heinz, gefangen
Bordfunker Ofw von Kiedrowski, Karl, gefangen
Bordschütze Uffz Piontek, Oskar, gefangen
Uffz Piontek von III/KG 30. Uffz Piontek 1940-11-15 im Lazarett gestorben.


Chris Goss
24th October 2013, 12:05
Suggest you get hold of my book Luftwaffe's Battle of Britain: The Bombers Battle which has photos of the crash and account from Podbielski based on the K report and his recollections. I believe it is also covered in one of Bill Norman's books

James Farrimond
24th October 2013, 12:21
Hi Chris

Ordered your book a week or so ago. Still be interested to see the original reports. save me a trip to the NA.


Chris Goss
24th October 2013, 13:03
Will have a look tonight but what are you after? I have the NVM and no doubt someone else on this Forum might beat me to it in respect of the K

James Farrimond
24th October 2013, 14:42
The K would be ideal

Chris Goss
24th October 2013, 19:42
Don't have the K to hand but the G said:

Crashed 1810 hrs at Kirby Grindalythe near Malton Yorks MR A.3887. Markings 5J+ER (E in white). Crest: flying bat on yellow crescent moon. Tips of spinners white. Airframe manufactured by Norddeutsche Dornier Werke under licence to Junkers in 1940. Wk Nr 1258. Engines: Jumo 211B made by Junkers, Dessau (Wk Nrs 47853 & 62847). This aircraft is said to have been brought down by light AA fire and the starboard engine was put out of action. Aircraft made a good belly landing. Armament: Only 4 MG 15s fitted as follows: 2 upper rear, one front nose and one lower rear. Armour: The usual protection fitted for pilot's seat and upper and lower rear gunners. Crew: 4. One dead and 3 prisoners.

Podbielski said 3 of them attacked and Linton on Ouse reported being attacked by 3 ac at 1815 hrs and that one was damaged. Some think that Podbielski attacked Driffield (2 ac apparently attacked). Podbielski referred to his target as Malton on Ouse and that there were Whitleys based there and the NVM says Linton.

James Farrimond
25th October 2013, 09:59
Cheers Chris

Peter Cornwell
25th October 2013, 10:53
Herewith relevant documents.

bill norman
25th October 2013, 12:05
FlyPast magazine was supposed to publish my account of this incident in the current issue (they've had the piece since last February) - but didn't. Perhaps the article will see the light of day in the the next issue...?

Bill Norman

Chris Goss
25th October 2013, 12:17
Interesting that the K report doesn't mention Linton (and the NVM & Podbielski does) and Linton said it was attacked by 3 Ju 88s, one of which was damaged and was assumed to be the one that crash-landed. Also, the Wk Nr from the G report doesn't match the NVM or QMG's returns.


Apart from Linton, have you ascertained which other airfields were attacked by III/KG 30 that day?
As to next issue of Flypast and is due out at the end of this month, it is a Luftwaffe Special so possibly but the emphasis is on the He 111 not Ju 88 so be prepared to be disappointed?

10th November 2013, 14:54

Friedrich Franz Podbielski (born 1. October 1908) was a cousin of my father.

a picture of his aircraft you can found here:



11th November 2013, 02:00
Also, the Wk Nr from the G report doesn't match the NVM or QMG's returns.

Chris, quite right, this 1258 is "Serial Number" - as the TNA AIR 22/266 CREA report says - and is not same as W-Nr. 0886129 (CREA does not say its an W-Nr. does it?) Well its not the same, but is truly a valid Serial number, certainly from the part plate it was obtained from..

These were the B.Nr. known from many other NDW / HWO made Ju 88´s (i.e part plates) and fits quite well be about the 258th (fuselage) by NDW, that was fitted to (088)6129, as HWO was their building partner, supplying the wings to NDW, and getting fuselages from NDW.

Simple math here: 258 divided by two, you have 129 (0886129).
And they started at B.Nr. 1001 for A-1, and 2001 for A-4´series.
My take here is that NDW Ju 88 part numbers serials, known from under 1001 (and there are some) be likely supplied to other assembly lines, and NDW parts are indeed known from other assemblers airplanes.

I have indentified some such numbers in various publications, reports and such, even attempted tying them down to unknown W.Nr´s in crash reports. Problem here is finding if they were close enough to original plane or month, or if it were all parts with the same B.Nr. that made up the same airplane, or in which order they were issued to NDW or HWO assembly lines.

Such B.Nr.´s numbers are also known from NDW He 111´s, and other similar numbers are known from factories in Ju 88 program alone, but some of this stuff has had aviation enthusiasts "baffled" for decades. It seems many goes for the W-Nr., and behave ther be no other "Holy Grail" to pusue (sorry the pun, no offence meant).


Chris Goss
11th November 2013, 15:49
Torgau: Thanks for you post. This is one of quite a number of photos of this aircraft