Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/index.php)
-   Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/forumdisplay.php?f=8)
-   -   A ?? RE: an engagement on June 14 1944... (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=17186)

NickM 11th June 2009 21:42
Re: A ?? RE: an engagement on June 14 1944...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Csaba Becze (Post 87229)
Nick,

One Hungarian Messer crashed and one belly landed due to combat damage. One German aircraft also was shot down. The number of Axis planes was not so high, but there are always enough cause for the overclaim in such furious dogfights.
I guess it was high enough: 32 Hungarians Me; not sure how many LW fighters(some sources said 70++)--what LW units were involved--Numbers & the Gruppen if you have it; IF my memory is still functioning the 49th only numbered 12;

thx

nickm

Csaba B. Stenge 11th June 2009 23:18
Re: A ?? RE: an engagement on June 14 1944...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by NickM (Post 87232)
I guess it was high enough: 32 Hungarians Me; not sure how many LW fighters(some sources said 70++)--what LW units were involved--Numbers & the Gruppen if you have it; IF my memory is still functioning the 49th only numbered 12;

thx

nickm
70+ Luftwaffe planes - that was a fairy tale. Only one Luftwaffe Staffel engaged the 49th and only in the very last phase of the dogfight (the 4./JG 302, the Höhenstaffel). 30 Hungarian vs 15 US planes, 2 vs 1 rate, nothing special, or extremely rare, since the rates were much higher in the opposite side - 200-300 US fighters vs 50-80 German Hungarian fighters, but generally much-much less defenders. Sometimes 15-20 Hungarians vs 200 escort fighters (over 10 vs 1) AND they got a strict order to avoid the fighters, engage only the bombers, so impossible to compare it in any way.

NickM 12th June 2009 06:25
Re: A ?? RE: an engagement on June 14 1944...
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Csaba Becze (Post 87238)
70+ Luftwaffe planes - that was a fairy tale. Only one Luftwaffe Staffel engaged the 49th and only in the very last phase of the dogfight (the 4./JG 302, the Höhenstaffel). 30 Hungarian vs 15 US planes, 2 vs 1 rate, nothing special, or extremely rare, since the rates were much higher in the opposite side - 200-300 US fighters vs 50-80 German Hungarian fighters, but generally much-much less defenders. Sometimes 15-20 Hungarians vs 200 escort fighters (over 10 vs 1) AND they got a strict order to avoid the fighters, engage only the bombers, so impossible to compare it in any way.
Of course...I'm sure it was stressful enough to be outnumbered 2-3 to 1(depending when 4/JG302 l got involved), far from home & slightly outclassed, performance wise...

NM

GaraiB 12th June 2009 11:24
Re: A ?? RE: an engagement on June 14 1944...
 
2 Attachment(s)
Hello’

I would like to enclose one page from my Grandfather’s loogbook,
Kalman Garai was a pilot in the 5/1 Hungarian Night Fighter Unit. This day 14 of June 1944, he flew by Focke Wulf 58 Weihe. His radio-gunner was György Garzó.
This week the unit had training days, without any combat mission.

The unit had few (2-3pc.) Focke Wulf 58 all were painted grey colour.

Kind regards,

GaraiB


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 05:48.
Page 2 of 2 < 1 2
Show 40 post(s) from this thread on one page

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2026, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net