Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

I have attempted to compile a list of all III./KG 100 Do 217K-2 aircraft. When I get home in a few days I will check my files to see if I have this information.

Marty

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

If anyone wanted to search TNA HW5/339 through to (maybe) HW5/442 there might be some clues — deciphered take-off or landing reports, even a report of the operation.

Another possible source would be HW13/36, German Naval Air Activity (GNA) Vol. X (July 1 1943-Sept 30 1943). I have looked briefly at a couple of later volumes in the series and they synthesise ULTRA and radio monitoring information.

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

I notice something on this famous picture of Deumling in front of his Do217:

although there are no markings that would allow an individual recognition of the aircraft, there is a strange triangle, above Deumling, just before the plexiglass;

It reminds me of the fuel octane indexes trianle ("87") you could see on the Bf109 but obviously, at this place, it is not such marking.

Any idea ??

GC

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

Gilles, it is most probably a fuel octane triangle or similer. The fuel octane triangle was in a similer location on the He111. An ideal position for quick recognition whilst standing on the ground.

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

thanks Clint.
GC

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

Any ULTRA expert around that would be able to try the idea of Nick Beale here above ??

"If anyone wanted to search TNA HW5/339 through to (maybe) HW5/442 there might be some clues — deciphered take-off or landing reports, even a report of the operation.

Another possible source would be HW13/36, German Naval Air Activity (GNA) Vol. X (July 1 1943-Sept 30 1943). I have looked briefly at a couple of later volumes in the series and they synthesise ULTRA and radio monitoring information."

thanks...

GC

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

Meanwhile, an ULTRA from July 1944 for Marty:

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

Very interesting.. Thanks

But I wonder what this could mean:

" no 300% 40371 FROM A.O. FOR BOMBERS DEPT FK... "

Good evening

GC

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

It means "[Message] No. 340371 from General der Kampfflieger, Department for Flugkörper [guided weapons]."

"C%4" means that there were fair indications that the number was 4 - the British were not certain. "B%" meant "strong indications" and "D%" was "slight indications."

Re: what is the Wnr of the Do217 that sank the Roma in September 1943 ?
 

Very interesting, especially since it was just a month later that the Luftwaffe for all intents and purposes terminated anti-ship glide-bomb operations.

Thanks, Nick.

PS: At some point I need to get Ultra Luftwaffe decrypts for 1940 and 1941. I am unaware of any electronic repository for these records -- is that also your understanding?