Re: A-20 in distress
 

There were two enlisted men from the 47th BG captured on the same day as Edgar D Hinshaw. "If" the photo is of their ship, it is surprising the gunners survived.

S/Sgt ARCHER, GORDON M, 20645968 and
S/Sgt MESSEMER, JOHN E 12027198.

On the 47th BG website there is a MACR report of a "No. 41" loss here (one of the eyewitness statements (by Sgt Leblock) refers to the plane as No 41) :

http://www.47thbombgroup.org/macr/52.html

In reading through the MACR, there are some items of interest. The plane was hit by flak and the port (left side) engine was set on fire. The mission was to an airfield in Sicily and all the crew were killed as the plane was later attacked by fighters. The plane was an A-20B, 41-3252. The date was July 4, 1943 which is later than was originally estimated, based on the plane's markings. There is a map in the MACR and it "might" be possible to identify something in the photo to that location in Sicily, "if" this crash was the plane in the photo.

Re: A-20 in distress
 

Unclear what bearing this has on this discussion, if any. The MACR which Rolland linked to for aircraft 41-3252 is also available on fold3.com for those with access:

https://www.fold3.com/image/29416338

The primary difference in this document and that linked to by Rolland is the first page. Normally in a MACR file this page would be blank except for the MACR number in the top left corner. This is not the case with this document where the first page is an image of a manila folder where on the identification tab is simply written -51-. The significance of which is unclear but may suggest 41-3252 was the 47th BG aircraft #51. Unclear why the web site refers to it as "41" in other instances.

Anyway, the crew remains of 41-3252 were recovered postwar and returned to the U.S. then interred in a common grave at the Zachary Taylor National Cemetery, Louisville, Kentucky:

2nd Lt Oriell “Dub” Mitcham; https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/...oriell-mitcham

Sgt John F Kelly; https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/...7/john-f-kelly

SGT Frank Mast Montgomery; https://www.findagrave.com/memorial/...ast-montgomery

May they rest in peace together

Re: A-20 in distress
 

Thanks to all for their input.At least the Bomber Group and probably the squadron is identified.

Re: A-20 in distress
 

Hi all,

in the mACR report there is a info about enemy fighter, which attack this machine. Is there any claim from luftwaffe or Italian side?

thanks

Faenor

Re: A-20 in distress
 

Joe Baugher has:

http://www.joebaugher.com/usaf_serials/1941_1.html

A-20B DL, Havoc:
41-3252 (47th BG, 85th BS) shot down by Oblt. Heinz-Edgar Barres in Bf 109G-6 of JG 77/1. 1 mi NE of Sciacca, Sicily, Italy Jul 4, 1943. 3 KIA. MACR 52.


I am trying to contact the 47th BG website and see if we can learn more. I have a theory about the photo.

UPDATE: I received a reply from Mark O'Boyle (47th BG website owner/administrator). He says -- It is without question Mitcham, Kelly, and Montgomery / MACR 52.

Here again is the link to the photo as shown on the 47th BG website:

http://www.47thbombgroup.org/picture...mages/249.html


My theory is the photo is a cropped and enlarged Strike Attack Vertical photo, taken by one of the other planes during the attack. When I look closely at the photo, I think I can see bomb bursts on "bottom right" edge. The photo may in-fact be "rotated" with "East" more or less toward the bottom. That would point the plane along the flight path as is shown in the MACR. The "original" full sized SAV photo apparently no longer exists.

Re: A-20 in distress
 

Wow, amazing work. Then, we can definitively identify this A/C as 41-3252. lost July 4,1943.

Re: A-20 in distress
 

Does anybody have a 47th BG mission list?
I'm especially interested in missions over Yugoslavia, Nov 43-Apr 44, and again Nov 44-Apr 45.

Re: A-20 in distress
 

By the way, what you feel is a flak hit could also have been caused by a collision, or not?

Danny