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-   -   Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940 (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=54343)

Dan History 10th July 2019 19:56
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
Gentlemen, your assistance is excellent!

Col, I did not know about that book, thank you. Here it is on Amazon:
The Luftwaffe Over Brum: Birmingham's Blitz from a Military Perspective https://www.amazon.co.uk/Luftwaffe-O...dp/0956370837/

Chris, thank you for telling me an update to that book is forthcoming and for mentioning the Einzelmeldung. Did you get a copy at Freiburg? For the benefit of Mr. Walpole, who is reading this thread, here is your book on Amazon:
The Luftwaffe's Blitz: The Inside Story November 1940-May 1941 https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/0859791483/

Nick, the codenames reported by ULTRA are most interesting. I did not expect that the surnames of Nazi leaders would have been used. May I ask whether this is from HW 5? My understanding of the specifics of the various ULTRA file series is relatively unsophisticated.

Kind regards,

Dan

Nick Beale 10th July 2019 21:57
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dan History (Post 271599)
Nick, the codenames reported by ULTRA are most interesting. I did not expect that the surnames of Nazi leaders would have been used.
Those are British substitutions for the original German codenames which were all major rivers. The change was made to avoid giving the Germans a "crib" to break into British codes. The instruction for this was issued on 19 November:
CX/JQ/463
NAVIGATIONAL BEAMS
IMPORTANT NOTICE

2. As from 0001/20/11/40 source CX/JQ will not refer to river type beams by their original names, but will use the following code-words:
WESER = HITLER
SPREE = GOERING
RHEIN = RIBBENTROP
ELBE = HIMMLER
DONAU = QUISLING
ODER = SCHIRACH
ISAR = HESS
What had been known colloquially as "river beams" now became "Ruffians".

Quote:
May I ask whether this is from HW 5?
TNA HW 5/7.

Bombphoon 11th July 2019 17:31
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Beale (Post 271550)
And here's all the ULTRa I've found which mentions the raid.
Hi Nick - Do you have the Ultra mentioning the raid on Leicester on 19/20.11.1940 please? Much appreciated.

Nick Beale 11th July 2019 18:17
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
1 Attachment(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombphoon (Post 271637)
Hi Nick - Do you have the Ultra mentioning the raid on Leicester on 19/20.11.1940 please? Much appreciated.
The attached from CX/JQ/465 (from TNA HW 5/6) may be relevant but after a quick look nothing else stands out.

Chris Goss 11th July 2019 18:17
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
I have the Luftflotte 3 reports-just I./LG 1 and I./KG 54 involved. III./KG 27 attacked Leicester 20-21 Nov 40 as well

Dan History 11th July 2019 23:15
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick Beale (Post 271607)
Those are British substitutions for the original German codenames which were all major rivers. The change was made to avoid giving the Germans a "crib" to break into British codes. The instruction for this was issued on 19 November

TNA HW 5/7.
Nick, thank you very much :) Now everything is clear.

Bombphoon 12th July 2019 02:24
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
Thank you Chris and Nick, appreciated.

Nick - I take it WESER and SPREE are the beam transmitters?

Nick Beale 12th July 2019 08:17
Re: Luftwaffe in Birmingham area on 11 December 1940
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bombphoon (Post 271663)
Thank you Chris and Nick, appreciated.

Nick - I take it WESER and SPREE are the beam transmitters?
Yes. See post #12 above, also the article “KGr. 100 and the Coventry Blitz” on my website.


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