Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Hi
205 Group, as far as is recalled, was the only group that volunteered
to supply the Warsaw uprising.
205 Group was:OC Maj Gen Jimmy Durrant(SAAF)
2 SAAF Wing (31.34 SAAF sqns)(OC Col JA Williams SAAF)
240 RAF Wing (178, 614 RAF sqn)
231RAF Wing (37,70 RAF sqn)
2 more Wings of 2 sqn each
The 3 sqns that volunteered for Warsaw were 31,34 SAAF and 178 RAF.
The last night a Polish sqn went after the 3 sqns that went almost ceased to exist as almost all a/c were by now lost or u/s.
Stefaan

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

What exactly does the word "volunteered" mean in this context? There's no way heavy bomber squadrons can operate without official backing. Volunteered by the commander of the group? By the Air Staff? Only volunteer crews, because of the dangers of the missions?

205 Group was the only formation with the range to reach Warsaw with reasonable payload. The other units in the group, that didn't "volunteer", were operating Wellingtons at this time, which didn't have the range. Except for 614 which was the SOE unit, so they would be operating in support of underground organisations across Eastern Europe, and particularly into the Balkans.

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Hello friends,

some info from "Chronik des Seekrieges":

a) http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg/44-04.htm#09-3004,
b) http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg...ost/donau1.htm,
(scroll down for fine links),
c) http://www.wlb-stuttgart.de/seekrieg...tille.htm#IMRD

Greetings

Darius

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Hi Graham.
The preamble to the Warsaw drops are found in many publications that is freely available.
The range of 1800 miles in terrible weather,11 hrs flight,10 of them over enemy country with no fighter escort and then descending to 300 ft
was considered suicidal by the High Brass.
The initiation to do those raids was done by Churchill himself and it was a request and specified NOT an order.
There were some Halifax sqn as well and the Poles had a flight that did the last raids.
S Africa and Poland has had an annual commemeration service for more than 60 years on the 6th of Sept.
If you are intersted I suggest you get that book
Stefaan

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Stefaan
Just a question. I recall hearing some 15-20 years ago, that a Warsaw Airlift monument was founded in RSA to be moved to Warsaw. As communistic goverment declined, it was temporarily placed in Johannesburg (I believe). Could you tell me if there is anything close to the truth in the story?

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Stefaan: I have the book about the SAAF effort, though it is a few years since I read it, and other accounts. The point I was making was that your comment "the only Group that volunteered" was at least misleading and arguably mean-spirited. 205 Group was the only Group that "volunteered" because it was the only Group that had the aircraft capable of doing the job. Every unit capable of assisting did, at great cost.

However, in a time of war, I wonder just what the difference is between a request from Churchill and an instruction?

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Hi Franek and Graham
There is a place where they have the services.I don't know if there is a memorial all though I seem to remember that there is one.Will try to find out.
Graham.In the book the responce to Churhill's request was that,We volunteered for this sort of thing when we joined up so we have to do it.
I agree that we were capable to do it but there were other units that also operated B-24's out of Italy,as well as B-17's.I do not know the reasons
why they did not do it as I am not familiar with their circumstances at the time.
Regards
Stefaan

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

@Michi: I'm researching a wreckage of an Wellington Bomber southwest of St.Pölten. Eyewitness told me that the plane crashed the night of 29th/30th May 1944. I believe that this Wellington was involved in mining the danube. Send me a private message to get in contact with you.
Kurtl (Niederösterreich)

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Yes.
31 and 34 sqdrns
Stefaan

Re: RAF 205th Bomber Group & Operation Gardening...
 

Hi
A copy of an order of battle I found in our archives re MAAF.
Stefaan