Re: Joachim Kirschner vs claims
 

Hi all
I'm not even close to you guys in this but I did try to find some answers in Kirschner later claims with IV./JG27 and his loss later on.
23.10.43. Cetinje and SW of Podgorica - 2 Spitfires (one Re 2002 lost, other badly damged)
25.10.43. SW of Ulcinj - P38 (one P-38 lost but unclear because 4 others claimed P-38 as well)
01.11.43. SW of Bar - Hurricane and P-40 (1 Mc 205 badly damaged 1 MC 205 slightly damaged - no losses ???)
15.11.43. I have nothing
16.11.43. I have nothing
17.11.43. SW Pireaus and Dispora island - P38 and B-25 (P-38 and B-25 lost but also unclear because others claimed P-38 and B-25)
18.11.43. I have nothing
Please correct me if I am wrong

and then he was shot down...
my sources (Bf 109 Yugo story vol I, Ciglić; Med air war vol 4., Shores and others)

Re: Joachim Kirschner vs claims
 

Hi Johannes & all,

you said it would be interesting to know what was the opinion of Kirschner's comrades. Well, here is one view from Heinrich "Heinz" Sannemann, who took over 5./JG 3 after Kirschner. The following quote comes from Breuer & Waiss book on Sannemann (Helios 2018). It is taken from a letter from Sannemann to his wife Marlies. He does not mention Kirschner by name, but it is obvious to whom he is referring to. I translated this book to Finnish language in 2019.

HS an MS, 15.10.1943:
„Habe seit gestern 12 Uhr eine Staffel. Sie hatte vorher ein jetzt versetzter Eichenlaubträger, der zwar ausgezeichnet abschoß, dabei aber bodenmäßig alles verludern ließ. Da habe ich also allerlei zu tun. So nebenbei fliege ich mich ein – bisher war allerdings meist Nebel – und wenn das alles fertig ist, werde ich wohl meine alte Staffel wieder übernehmen und dann möchte ich wohl auch mal wieder so ein bißchen abschießen! So eine Staffel zu haben, ist doch wieder ganz etwas anderes. Da kann man wieder mit Freude arbeiten!“

BTW, Johannes, many thanks for your great work on claims. Highly appreciated!

Br Raimo

Re: Joachim Kirschner vs claims
 

Reference Lt. Joachim Kirchner of 5./JG 3 claiming a LaGG-3 (35) at 07:04 on the 13 Sep 1942 at PlQu 47593, this was checked by Nikita Ergorov. His research determined that Kirchner did not shoot down one of the LaGG-3s from 21 IAP and 5 GIAP in the dogfight that took place

Re: Joachim Kirschner vs claims
 

According to Johannes Mathews and John Foreman, the aircraft was a P-47. This is also the type of aircraft listed by Prien, Stemmer, Rodeike and Bock in 2008. However, in 2003 Prien and Stemmer listed this claim as a B-17. Also John Weal in 2013.
This website
http://www.cieldegloire.fr/jg_003e.php
agrees with Johannes Mathews.