Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Stig, I can assure you that picking up a belly landed plane by the mechanics was not an issue in Hungary as long as it landed on their own side. The nature of WWII that swept across Hungary did not leave a cm long gap between Soviet ground forces along the front lines, so everything was accessible. OTER, BAO and other mechanic organizations were not made for no reason ;-)

Robert: you'll see it next year ;-)

Gabor

P.S.: RLM LP regulations also had a thing to say about enemy aircraft belly landing on enemy territory [hint, hint, hint ;-) ]

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

No, I agree with that.
That is always a problem when you fight a defensive war and in this case were constantly on the run.

I was just ribbing you a little with regard to the flat tyre....:)

Cheers
Stig

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Hi

for example;

On February 9, 1943, the troops of the Red Army fought for the possession of Timoshevskaya and other points in the Kuban.
Having received the task to attack the Slavyanskaya airfield, the 66th IAP aircraft covered the IL-2. In the ensuing air battle, navigator of the 66th IAP Major Sayfutdinov was shot down. On a downed plane, he made an emergency tree landing in the Red Forest in the territory occupied by the enemy. For three days he hid near the plane and on the fourth day Saifutdinov was found and hid by the forester Novikov. Together with Sayfutdinov, Novikov disguised and kept the Yak-1 plane until the arrival of the Red Army units, after which he handed over the plane to the technical team against receipt.
Hartmann was among the riflemen, so aerial victory, or at least for a few weeks. Or was it not an aerial victory.

During the summer of 1943, 13 OTTR evacuated 42 aircraft from the sites of forced landings. The department cut 26 aircraft into parts. During the offensive period of the 2nd Belorussian Front, Senior Sergeant Zizevsky took part in the evacuation of 27 aircraft from the places of forced landings, in addition, 2 aircraft were evacuated from under enemy fire.


Regards

BenFolk

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

1) Upon what do you base your statement that the book will not be unbiased, given that it has not been published yet? Unless you have seen an advance copy...

2) When will this be published, and by whom? I will be looking to pick up a copy.

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Hi John, here it is:
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Verified-Vi...6&unfiltered=1

Gabor

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Yeah, next year. That's why I asked Robert how he knew the book 'will not be unbiased'. Waiting for his answer...

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Still waiting for a reply to my post #244 from robert.

Quick to make statements, slow to reply (if at all)...

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Robert, instead of making personal attacks, how about giving a straight answer to a simple question?

If you can't manage that, don't bother posting.

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

And of course Mr. Vasco is not doing personal attacks?

Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories
 

Answer is simple: because the Soviets did not report everything. Polish Campaign 1939 is a good example: some Soviet planes were downed by Polish fighters. Some of the Soviet aircrews were captured and interrogated but there is no trace in Soviet documents.