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-   -   The first ace to reach a certain score (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=47778)

HGabor 10th April 2023 15:03

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
Thank you Nick, I just try to find out what really happened in the past with all available evidences. That's all.
Cheers,
Gabor

knusel 12th April 2023 08:56

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
In a few cases the dates are missing which makes it harder to verify a claim and even harder to negate it.
For example Hartmann's #347.

HGabor 12th April 2023 11:33

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
If the date is missing, it is equally difficult to prove, or disprove a claim, - neither is harder than the other. However, there are visible tendencies for each pilot.

knusel 12th April 2023 12:14

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
Sometimes also the claimed aircraft type is unknown, for example Hartmann's #346.

HGabor 12th April 2023 12:33

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
Agree.

knusel 13th April 2023 09:49

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
Hartmann claimed a large number of Lavochkin fighters but a low number of Yakovlev fighters. I suspect he misidentified many Yakovlev's as LaGG-3's. They looked similar but the former were much more numerous in the second half of the war than the latter.

HGabor 13th April 2023 12:14

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
In the final months of 1944 Hartmann fought with air units of the Soviet 5th Air Army (and perhaps the 17th Air Army). By the end of 1944 the 5 VA suffered heavy losses in their battles for Debrecen and Budapest, while the 17 VA was more or less intact, advancing in Yugoslavia and later in Southern-Hungary.

On January 1, 1945 the fighter forces of the 5 VA had:

83 Yak-1
109 Yak-9
16 Yak-3
130 La-5
20 La-7

(Book: 'Verified Victories', p.25)

The 17 VA had:

117 Yak-1
13 Yak-7
147 Yak-9
58 Yak-3
273 La-5
1 La-7

(Book: 'Verified Victories', p.27)

Gabor

knusel 13th April 2023 12:54

Re: The first ace to reach a certain score
 
When Hartmann arrived at the front the short heyday of the LaGG-3 was over. But the Germans kept on identifying similarly-looking opponents as such. It's like Manfred von Richthofen & Co who named lattice-tail planes "Vickers" when certainly no Vickers F.B.5 planes were sent up anymore.


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