Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Here is tonight's update. Not as much movement as hoped.

As mentioned before - any corrections and/or additions would be much appreciated. Especially where I have not included a lot of detail.

The next file to start on is 000269 which contains a lot of Luftwaffe K.St.N.s.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello Andy,


You're doing a great job!


One thing you might add is the corresponding NARA roll, whenever this is easy to track.



OdL Lagebericht (feel free to double check, no one has proof-read this ;) ):

-104, -113, -115 are also in T77 R917
-116, -117, -119 to -124 in R918
-125, -127, -128, -130 to -134, -160 in R919
-136, -137, -139, -140, -142 in R920
-159 in R924
-162 to -164, -166 in R925

-167 to -170 in R926
-171 to -172 in R927


I'm not familiar enough with Luftwaffe records to tell whether the "Einzelnachrichten des Ic Dienstes West/Ost der Luftwaffe" are also somewhere in the NARA microfilms. If so, you might want to add the roll number; if not, you could also say so to point that the documents are uncommon.



Final thought: it seems some folders duplicate the same information. Not 100% sure though, but -056 and -058 do seem identical. There may be more cases.


Cheers,


Mori

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Mori,

Thanks for the update.

Here is the latest listing with additions from 269 -277; 437-440 and 498-499.

More to follow.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Of the files in TsAMO-folder 12452 at least seven files originate from the Finnish Military Archive (nowadays attached to the Finnish National Archive), and were requested by the Allied (Soviet) Control Commission from the Archive in Helsinki in 1944-1945 (see my notes 89 and 103 above).
Identified files of the Finnish Archive are:

- No. 298: Daily Situation Reports of Luftflotte 1 1.7-31.12.1941; sent to the Finnish AF HQ (Ilmavoimien esikunta) by the Finnish Liaison Officer at LFl 1 HQ

- No. 299: Daily Situation Reports of Luftflotte 1 3.1-27.8.1942, sent to the Finnish AF HQ by the LW Liaison Officer in Finland (Der Deutsche Verbindungsoffizier bei Führungsstab der finnischen Luftwaffe)

- No. 300: Luftflotte 1 and Luftflotte 5 Daily Reports 1.1-8.6.1944; sent to the Finnish AF HQ by the LW Liaison Officer in Finland

- No. 450: Luftflotte 1 and Luftflotte 5 Daily Reports 1.1-2.6.1942 sent to the Finnish AF HQ by the Finnish Liaison Officer at LFl 1 HQ

- No. 523: Luftflotte 1 and Luftflotte 5 Daily Reports 24.8-31.12.1942; sent to the Finnish AF HQ by the LW Liaison Officer in Finland

- No. 524: Various letters sent to Finnish AF HQ by the LW Liaison Officer in Finland 23.12.1941-27.8.1944

- No. 525: Luftflotte 1 and Luftflotte 5 Daily Reports 1.1-30.12.1943; sent to the Finnish AF HQ by the LW Liaison Officer in Finland

The above listed files are thus NOT war-booty from OKL-archives, but they originate from the Finnish Military Archive, where they were deposited by the Finnish AF HQ in late autumn 1944.

The Finnish origin can be seen from signatures and comments (in Finnish!) in several documents in hand-writing by high-ranking Finnish AF officers.
These Finnish documents have thus been wrongly included in the OKL folder by some unknowing TsAMO official!

As can bee seen in the above list some Air Force files seem still to be missing. Similar files with German-Finnish correspondence (eg. Finnish Navy-OKM, and Marshal Mannerheim´s HQ- OKW/OKH) can obviously also be found in the TsAMO document collection.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Further update (including the items that I lost yesterday due to stupidity!)

I have deleted some previous versions of this file as I was running out of allowed space.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Further attached update covering files 306 - 425

That's interesting. I suppose very few of us could have spot this Finnish caracteristic.

The GDIR series are a mix of documents captured in the field and documents found at Potsdam or other places. They just put everything related to, say, army corps, in the same directory. That's understandable.

For example, I saw the German translation of French GHQ documents captured in 1940 (directives by Gamelin etc.). Certainly this was not to be found on field army headquarters fighting on the Eastern Front.

You sometimes get letters from the head archivist, like "please send me those files", and the reply from the officier abiding to the request.

Andy,

A couple more duplicates:

12452-012 seem identical to -001

12452-424 seem identical to -425 (except maybe for a handful of large size pages)

Mori

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Andy,
Another duplicate: -476 and -477 seem identical.
Cheers,
Mori

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello all

Another major update of the website
http://wwii.germandocsinrussia.org/d.../1-bestand-500

Findbuch 12470 - Heeresgruppe Don, Süd (2. Aufstellung), Nordukraine, Mitte (2. Aufstellung), 1943-1945

Findbuch 12471 - Heeresgruppe E, F

Findbuch 12485 - Artillerie-, Beobachter-, Panzerjäger- und Flakabteilungen der Wehrmacht

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello,

Here is the latest update to the listing for 12452

Not much more to go.

As before any corrections or additions would be much appreciated

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Andy

500-12452-000644 should be ZG 76 I.Gruppe KTB 25.8.-5.10.39
And not Polenkrieg 1939 I./JG 76 Kriegstagebuch

Jaap

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Jaap,

Apologies, can't read!:o

Have corrected the sheet for the next issue

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Good Morning,

Apologies for the delay in finalising the spreadsheet.

Attached is an expanded copy including rows that highlight file names not found in the torrent. In addition the is now a column for "Suggested Equivalents" containing, in some instances, names of files in NARA and Bundesarchiv - these have been provided by colleagues via posts in this thread and/or via e-mail.

Please feel free to download, edit and use as you see fit. Also, any additions/corrections are always welcome.

I have uploaded this file to a page on the LuftwaffeData Wiki so that if I have to delete the file here it is still available to those that need it.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello Andy,


I have found out that have incomplete NARA T77 guide (last roll 911 but full set is 1687 rolls). Do you have the parts with rolls 912-1687?


Best regards,
Andrey

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

A.M. wrote in part:
Splendid contribution, Andy, and many thanks from many of us for the time and effort you put into it! Hopefully, 12452 will be uploaded sooner rather than later by the Ger-Rus-TsAMO digitization guys so we can put your spreadsheet to use.

L. :)

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Larry,

Many thanks for your kind comments - there is a PM in your inbox.

Andrey,

Apologies, I am certain that I have a NARA T77 guide somewhere. However, a quick search revealed that it must be in a "safe" place and I'm d$%%$£'d if I can remember where that is!:D

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Thank you, Andy

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Andrey,

Go to:

https://eservices.archives.gov/order...+Microfilm+MIF

and write T77 into Search-box and you will get the list of Catalogues T77A – T77N, By clicking for example T77G you will get a Publication summary of the Rolls 912-1051. By clicking „View Important Publication Details“ in the right hand upper corner you can download the contents of the rolls.

Matti

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Matti, thank you a lot! I have downloaded it.


Best regards,
Andrey

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

As it turned out, T77 contains Lageberichte OKL (in documents of Abteilung fuer Wehrmachtpropaganda) from the beginning of war to 6.Nov.41 (in TsAMO's Findbuch 12452 these reports in Barbarossa time are from 11.Sep. to 9.Nov.41).
I wonder if the other Lageberichte OKL exists (end of 1941 and the rest of war).


Best regards,
Andrey

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hi Andrey,

I believe the Imperial War Museum in England also has duplicates of the Abteilung fuer Wehrmachtpropaganda Lageberichte but they also end in 1941.

Among the other sources of Lageberichte/Tagemeldungen:

National Archives & Records Administration:

RG 242. National Archives Collection of Foreign Records Seized. OKL Lw.FüSt. Ic, ..Vorläufige Zusammenstellung der Bombenabwürfe; Lage- und Tagesmeldungen on OKW, 19 Oct. 1940-14 Feb. 1941, 4376-554 (Parts I and II), Von Rhoden Collection of Research Materials on the Role of the German Air Force in World War II, 1911-47, National Archives Microfilm Publication T-971, roll 40, frames 86-979.

Bundesarchiv/Militärarchiv:

RL 2 II/388. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw .FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 2: Reichsgebiet, February 1945.

RL 2 II/389. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 5: Reichsgebiet, April 1945.

RL 2 II/390. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 6: West, February 1945.

RL 2 II/391. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 8: West, 1 – 11 April 1945.

RL 2 II/392. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 9: Ost, February 1945.

RL 2 II/393. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 11: Ost, 5 – 29 April 1945.

RL 2 II/840. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 3: Reichsgebiet, 1 - 15 March 1945.

RL 2 II/841. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 4: Reichsgebiet, 16 - 31 March 1945.

RL 2 II/842. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 7: West, March 1945.

RL 2 II/843. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zu Schadensmeldungen (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). Bd 10: Ost, March 1945.

RL 2 II/844. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zum Feind- und eigenen Einsatz (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). 16 September 1943 – 25 September 1943.

RL 2 II/845. Morgen-, Abendmeldungen, Nachträge, Nachträge zum Feind- und eigenen Einsatz (Lw. FüSt. Ic Meldewesen). 26 September 1943 – 7 October 1943.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Thank you, Rod!


So we can only hope that the other timeframes survived the war mostly in the Heeres documents (not a whole Luftwaffe but specific Lfl, Fliegerkorps etc.
I. and IV.Fliegerkorps 1.Apr.-31.Dec.43 are my priority now, but so far the search gives a limited success only.


Best regards,
Andrey

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hi Andrey,

BArch/MA has more Luftwaffe (and even some OKW/OKH/OKM) Lagebereichte under signature RL 2 II, I've only listed the ones I'm familiar with personally.

...and a note for Andy, the OBdL Lagebereicht at TsAMO appear to be the same as the ones listed in the attached PDF document detailing files in BArch/MA RL 2 II (from second page of PDF, beginning Band 1, signature RL 2 II/900)…

Cheers

Rod

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Thank you, Rod!


Much appreciated.


Cheers,
Andrey

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello all,

Some series have been removed from the GDIR website. Don't know whether that's temporary - but a clear reason to make your own copy while it's up.

Moriii

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello all, just noticed today that some funds have been entirely deleted ? Does anyone have any clue ?

http://wwii.germandocsinrussia.org/ru/nodes/1-fond-500

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

I've heard that docs without watermarks were deleted. Hope they will return after watermark placing...

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello Andy,


Although some items are missing from Torrent, you may add what they are about:


-005 to -010: maps September 1939
-015 to -018: maps of London air defence
-022 to -045: daily maps Luftlage Ost, April 1943 (inc. daily friendly/enemy losses)
-061 to -070: maps August-September 1939

-073 to -076: maps August-September 1939
-078 to -083: maps August-September 1939
-085: map September 1939

-150: Ob.d.L. FüSt Ic. Orientierungsmappe Indien und Afghanistan
(I believe -154 is India only, and that the Afghanistan is filed under -150)
-181: Übersicht der Archivunterlagen Zielgruppen und Zielräume, April 1943
-182: Übersicht der Flugplätze SU, June 1943
-185: SU Fliegertruppe, September 1943
-186: GB Fliegertruppe, October 1943

-202: Einzelnachrichten des Ic Dienstes West Nr 42, April 1944
-208: Einzelnachrichten des Ic Dienstes West Nr 50, May 1944
-223: Einzelnachrichten des Ic Dienstes West Nr 58
-237: Einzelnachrichten des Ic Dienstes West Nr 80, November 1944


Cheers,


Mori

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Thanks Moriii will do.

Will re-issue sometime in the future.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

OKH is back online. Now with watermarks.

Junker

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

More items of the 12452 series:


-258 map of Luftgaukommandos
-264 map Germany 16th April 1945
-276 map France June 1939
-282 map France December 1939
-286 Flak map (no date)
-287 map Rumania
-299 Tagesmeldung des Luftflotte 1
-309 map 39-08
-314 map 39-08
-380 to -385 maps of operations on 15th September 1939 (Lagekarte 4)
-400 to -408 maps of operations on 20th September 1939 (Lagekarte 4)
-410 to -414 maps of operations on 24-25th September 1939 (Lagekarte 4)
-429 Luft. 4 Ic messages (Koluft, reports etc.) June-July 1941
-431 Luft. 4 Ic messages (Koluft, reports etc.) July-August 1941
-436 map Ukraine (no date)
-449 Fliegermeldungen LF 5 1942.1.1-6.2
-456 Luftgau 4 map (maybe 1937)
-458 Kriegsglierung d. Luftverteidigungskräfte I Flak, VIII Fliegekoprs, Fliegerfürher Krim August 1942

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Moriii,

Do you have a date range for 299?

Will add these with the others so that they are highlighted as not being in the torrent.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Yes, it's January-August 1942. I should have mentioned it to start with.


By the way, happy to share these files if you want them.


Cheers,


Mori

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

More items:


-473 Bielorussia map December 1942
-478 Brianks map (no date)

-503 OkL Räumen und Unrachbarmachen von Flugplätzen. Luft in Rumania
-519 and -520 Rumania map August 1944
-522 Italian map of Ploestli pipelines (no date)
-559 Flieg. Div 1 map Belgium-Germany September 1940
-667 3(F) 123 September 1939
-674 Fliergerführer September 1939


Cheers,


Mori

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello, Moriii!
Have you seen october 1944 docs of Luftflotte 6 in TSAMO?

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Hello

here is an updated listing of 12452 including information on some items not in the torrent and some corrections.

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Dear all,

May I pose a question re. the Heeresgruppe Mitte KTB records from TSAMO: has anybody gone through these records for the period of September 1943-1944 and help me to the Luftflotte 6 Abschlussmeldungen and (Teil)Orientierungen -daily (concluding) reports with regard to the number of own aircraft employed/successes/losses- these detail the employment of the Nachtjäger on the Central sector of the Eastern Front in this period, which I would like to use for the NCA series research.

Cheers and thanks for any help,

Theo

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

OKW is back online. Now with watermarks.
Junker

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

Brilliant -thanks for letting us know Jörn!

Cheers, Theo

Re: German docs in TSAMO
 

They have added new documents.
Junker