Re: Need first name of Uffz ___ Otten, of 3./StG1 FL at Oronsko, Poland, on 25.09.39
 

Mirek,

Thanx for your comments. No way to know for sure the exact cause of the belly landing incident unless we get some further reporting.

Regards,

Re: Need first name of Uffz ___ Otten, of 3./StG1 FL at Oronsko, Poland, on 25.09.39
 

Larry
of course one one could be sure of it, but even Ii was not combat damage (?) only bally-landing means 30-45 % damages.

mw

Re: Dating a funeral for a V.(Z)/LG1 Crew
 

Matti,

This is a very important clue in eliminating one possibility. Do we know whether the other crew from 22.04.40 was buried at Mannheim?

22 April 1940: 15.(Z)/LG1Messerschmitt Bf110C-1. Crashed into houses near Mannheim-Sandhofen and burnt out following engine failure on maintenance test flight. (FF) Oberlt Walter Clausen (Staffelkapitän) and mechanic killed. Aircraft 100% write-off.

"Merlin" thinks that this must be the crew being buried in the funeral ceremony, but I'm still skeptical of the light blue camouflage on those Bf110s that early. Very important for the profile project if he is right. Since Clausen was a Sta Kap, there certainly would have been an elaborate funeral ceremony for him, especially since he died during a period of very little combat activity.

Seeking photos of FL 3./StG1 Ju87B-1 during first day of the Polish Campaign by Oblt Bruno Dilley, Sta Kap
 

Hello,

I have one poor quality photo of this a/c in a salvage dump, but would appreciate knowing about other photos of it if they exist:

"1 September 1939 Polish Campaign: 3./StG1 Junkers Ju87B-1. Forced-landed in open country north of Mlawa damaged in attack by PZL P11s during sortie to bomb the radio station at Babice 5.15 p.m. Possibly that attacked by Ppor. Kazimierz Daszewski of 112 EM. FF Oberlt Bruno Dilley (Staffelkapitän) and gunner both unhurt. Aircraft A5+AL 20% damaged but repairable."

I want to do a color profile of this a/c for the EoE Project.

Re: Dating a funeral for a V.(Z)/LG1 Crew
 

Larry,
In Ludwig von Eimannsberger's book "Zerstörergruppe" on page 18-19 Oblt. Clausen's crash on April 22nd while based at Mannheim is described and claimed that "the next day the Staffel, under command of Clausen's radio operator Fw. Reinhold, bade a military Farewell to Clausen before the doors of the train that was to take him home to Husum closed".
I believe "Merlin" is right in thinking that this ceremony is what we can see on the photos.
BR
Göran

Re: Dating a funeral for a V.(Z)/LG1 Crew
 

Göran,

I think that this reference settles the issue, and "Merlin" is right in his analysis of this incident. The photos show the "Military Farewell" at Mannheim on 23 April 1940 for Clausen and his gunner. That decisively advances the date for an example of the light blue over-spray on 13.(Z)/LG1 Bf110s to that date, a month earlier than I'd suspected, and shakes up the profile order for the EoE project for that Staffel. Got to rethink this.

This may now relate to one of the crash photos that I posted earlier, which "Merlin" thinks may be the crash of Clausen's L1+AL. I'll post this here again for any further comments or help matching other crash photos.

"22 April 1940: 15.(Z)/LG1Messerschmitt Bf110C-1. Crashed into houses near Mannheim-Sandhofen and burnt out following engine failure on maintenance test flight. (FF) Oberlt Walter Clausen (Staffelkapitän) and mechanic killed. Aircraft 100% write-off."

My problem with this match-up is that there are no houses or structures visible in this photo, which, however, certainly looks like the crash of an a/c with a light-colored "A" on the smashed wingtip. This could, however, easily be accounted for by the angle from which the photo was taken, looking away from any structures it hit. Since this would have been a local crash to the airfield at Mannheim-Sandhofen, where the unit was based at the time, you'd certainly expect there to be photos in the collections of unit veterans from that time period. Does anyone else have photos of the scene of this crash, that might settle this issue?

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-2xZ...-2xZ876S-L.jpg

I should note that here is the alternative candidate for this crash:

12 May 1940: Lu_40-5-12a Bf110C 13-LG1 Possibly Lt Hans Gaffal, WIA-POW, hit trees Cashed & Burned Out at ‘Nugimont’, S of Blagny, France, Chris J. Ehrengardt Coll via 11-06 LJH Visit

The only way to resolve this may be to find another photo of the Clausen wreck with the houses in the background, or, alternatively, a photo of Gaffal's crash at "Nugimont." Who holds the proof for either scenario?

However, it may turn out that it's not wise to question the advice of a magician like "Merlin." He might turn me into a mouse or something for my impertinence. That would look pretty strange, a nearly 2 meter tall half-Viking, half-German mouse with an Irish name. That should scare the hell out of some Anglo-Saxon monks.

Regards,

Re: Seeking SN of 88 SQ Fairey Battle RHoR abandoned in Hangar at Mourmelon AF, France, during May, 1940
 

Hello,

I have now seen Kevin's evidence and can confirm that RH-L photographed damaged at Mourmelon was serial number L5526.

Thanx to Kevin for all of us trying to unravel the mystery on this one.

Re: Dating a funeral for a V.(Z)/LG1 Crew
 

Larry,
Just a small correction: Clausen's Bordfunker was not onboard in the accident but a mechanic who was killed. Clausen's Bordfunker did command the ceremony for Clausen and the mechanic the next day according to the book.
I don't beleive the photo you've posted here shows Clausen's Bf110 as according to Eimannsberger's book p.19: "Both wings were torn off in the following collision with houses, the aircraft's fuselage crashed into a street and skidded along it for about 200 meters. The loss of the wings caused the fuel tanks to empty their contents over the houses and into the street. Not until all of the ammunition had exploded could the bodies of Clausen and the mechanic who was with him be removed from the fuselage."
Does not seem to match the linked to photo.
BR
Göran

Re: Dating a funeral for a V.(Z)/LG1 Crew
 

Göran,

The text would seem to eliminate this photo as being the wreckage of Clausen's aircraft. However, for the history, I'd still like to locate a photo (s) of that crash.

This now seems much more likely to be the wreckage of Lt Hans Gaffal's L1+AH, down ‘Nugimont’, S of Blagny, France, on 12 May. Again, we still need some confirmation of this.

We're getting there.

Re: Seeking SN of 88 SQ Fairey Battle RHoR abandoned in Hangar at Mourmelon AF, France, during May, 1940
 

Hi,
Would be interesting to see what Kevin's photo reveals as the photo linked to by Larry, which I also have from eBay, more looks like L5527. The last digit for sure looks more like "7" than "6" to me. However, there migh be a much better image showing something else?
BR
Göran

Seeking source for 13.08.40 Loss of 3.(F)/22 Do17P that disappeared over the N Sea this date
 

Hello,

Seeking any possible source for this loss just posted on the EoE LW Loss DB by Peter C.

"13 August 1940 3.(F)/22 Dornier Do17P. Lost over the North Sea during long-range reconnaissance sortie, exact circumstances not recorded. FF Lt Reinhold Panhas killed, BO Fw Helmut Otto and BF Uffz Hans Bauer both missing. Aircraft 100% write-off.
The body of Panhans was later recovered from the Kattegat and buried at Göteborg"

Anybody got any ideas or further information?

Re: Seeking source for 13.08.40 Loss of 3.(F)/22 Do17P that disappeared over the N Sea this date
 

Location was 15 West 2970. There is a NVM at WASt. "Lt Panhans am 1940-10-07 bei Langeskar tot angeschwemmt". Otherwise no additional info.

Matti

Re: Seeking source for 13.08.40 Loss of 3.(F)/22 Do17P that disappeared over the N Sea this date
 

GQM just shows unknown cause with position "15 West 2970" (east of Aberdeen ?).

Re: Seeking source for 13.08.40 Loss of 3.(F)/22 Do17P that disappeared over the N Sea this date
 

Swedish spelling of the location where Lt.Panhans was found is 'Långeskär' on the Swedish westcoast. First buried at Grebbestad 1940-10-11. In the autumn of 1966 moved to Kviberg, Gothenburg.
Source: page 43, Bo Widfeldt, Tyska Nödlandare 1939-1945, Air Historic Research, 2007. ISBN 91-975467-4-7

Re: Seeking photos of 4.(F)/121 Ju88A-1 7A+FM that force landed wheels up on RAF Oaklington, near Cambridge, England, on 19.09.40
 

Larry two of the photographs you refer to are published in S J Peskett (1981) 'Strange Intelligence. From Dunkirk to Nuremberg' ISBN 0709189788. I remember them being exterior shots of the a/c being towed or pushed across the airfield, once its undercarriage had been lowered (it bellied in). I don't have a copy so can't answer but they will be credited there. A bit of a long way round but someone may give you the ref...


best

Chris Going

Re: Need confirmation of some pilots in 4./JG 51 in early 1940
 

Good afternoon Larry, i was wondering whether you managed to establish whether the pilots you were seeking, were with 4/JG51 during the time scale you were seeking.

Im quite sure most of 4/JG51's a/c were probably issued new when this unit was formed in November 1939, as to pilots on strength during this period i have scant information.
After nearly 7 years since you last posted i would be interested to hear of any updates?

Best regs,
Steve.

Re: Seeking photos of 4.(F)/121 Ju88A-1 7A+FM that force landed wheels up on RAF Oaklington, near Cambridge, England, on 19.09.40
 

Larry,

Luftwaffe Crash Archive, volume 4, pages 459-461.

Re: Seeking photos of 4.(F)/121 Ju88A-1 7A+FM that force landed wheels up on RAF Oaklington, near Cambridge, England, on 19.09.40
 

Thanx John,

We discussed this on the phone.

Larry

Seeking info/photos of Bf110 & He111 that made nose-tips at Stavanger-Sola AF circa April-May, 1940
 

Hello,

This photo is from the Holger Nauroth book "The Luftwaffe, From the North Cape to Tobruk 1939-1945" P23. It shows a Bf110C-1 of 2./ZG76 that ran onto soft ground and did a nose stand at Stavanger-Sola AF, Norway, sometime during April-May, 1940. The caption location of Oslo-Fornebu is incorrect as another photo absolutely confirms the location as Stavanger-Sola.

In the far left background is an He111 of an unknown unit but certainly either KG4 or KG26 that FL in soft ground at the same time.

I'm trying to do a color profile of the Bf110, but need photos showing the other side, and any insignia that might be there, presumably the 2./ZG76 "Ladybird" insignia, or possibly a top hat or both.

Regarding the He111, we've been scouring our collections and so far can't find any photos showing this one. It is NOT 1H+CN that did a nose tip at Vaernes, near Trondheim, Norway, during April-May, nor 5H+HP that did a nose tip after the tail was knocked off at Oslo-Fornebu on or about 18.04.40.

Who can help us document these markings of the two nose-tipped a/c at Sola, and/or provide date information regarding them.

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-vv6...-vv6F4Bm-M.jpg

Re: Seeking photos of 4.(F)/121 Ju88A-1 7A+FM that force landed wheels up on RAF Oaklington, near Cambridge, England, on 19.09.40
 

Just to be accurate it is, of course, RAF OAKINGTON.

Re: Seeking photos of 4.(F)/121 Ju88A-1 7A+FM that force landed wheels up on RAF Oaklington, near Cambridge, England, on 19.09.40
 

Chris,

Thanx. Noted and corrected in my files. Still looking for good source of high-res scans of these photos.

A real challenge to ID the type on this crashed fighter? during the WC of spring 1940
 

Hello,

I know getting an ID on this crash is going to be a well-near impossible challenge, but I'm going to take a shot at it. The first step is to see if anyone can ID the a/c type from any detail on the wreckage. No certainty that it's LW; could be French, British, Belgian or Dutch, but probably a fighter. Can any eagle-eye technical expert spot any detail that tells us what type this is?

The second step is does anyone have any other photos of this one, which might include a caption with type, place or date?

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-PLV...-PLVZgs6-L.jpg

Re: Seeking photos of 4.(F)/121 Ju88A-1 7A+FM that force landed wheels up on RAF Oaklington, near Cambridge, England, on 19.09.40
 

Chris Going,

Thanx for pointing me at "Strange Intelligence." One of the best photos of the FL is in that book, and was not published in the "Luftwaffe Crashes" volume. I've now got scans of these SI images. This will surely be one of our Ju88 color profile a/c. Again, thanx. Would have never been aware of that one unless you'd pointed this one out.

Re: Posting to the Allied Discussion form on British forces present at the Battle of The Heligoland Bay: 18 December 1939
 

Relevant and very interesting photo. Can anyone ID the pilots aside from Schumacher (2) Steinhoff (178) and Falk (8)?

http://www.ebay.de/itm/Berlin-Luftsi...item5d4d00a49c

Re: Posting to the Allied Discussion form on British forces present at the Battle of The Heligoland Bay: 18 December 1939
 

Hello,

second pilot from the right side is Hauptmann Wolfgang Falck. Second from left is possibly Unteroffizier Heinz Fresia.

Regards
Gunnar - Bf 110 -

Seeking photos/further info on crash of Bf110 of Lt Gaffal of 13.(Z)/LG1 on 12.05.40
 

Hello,

I'm seeking further information, and especially photos of this crashed Bf110 on 12.05.40:

According to our EoE LW Loss DB:

12 May 1940: 13.(Z)/LG1 Messerschmitt Bf110C. Lost control in vertical dive avoiding attacks from, S/Lt Boitelet and Sgt Tallent of GC I/5, also Sgt Guillaume of GC III/7, over Vouziers and hit trees at ‘Nugimont’, south of Blagny, France, at 7.15 a.m. FF Lt Hans Gaffal thrown from aircraft and captured with fractured skull, admitted to hospital in Ste-Menehould, BF Uffz Aloysius Dierkes also captured wounded – both later released. Aircraft L1+AH 100% write-off.

A French researcher has provided this information: "I found (file 1D26 at SHD) that the aircraft was slightly damaged and also (file 2D58 at SHD) the note that the Bf 110 was nearly intact."

Surely photos exist somewhere of this crash. Who can help?

Seeking ID of a Hs126 crash, apparently in France during the WC
 

Hello,

Recently got this photo on eBay. Obviously it has the individual letter "A" and appears to be a crashed Hs126. No caption info came with it other than it's probably in France, which may be unreliable. Does anyone have other photos or info that would help ID this one?

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-Ds9...-Ds9BH4T-L.jpg

Seeking photos of 5./ZG76 Bf110C that FL near Boulogne on 04.09.40
 

Hello,

The EoE WG (Working Group) is seeking photos, further loss details and pilot name of this a/c. Specific location at Boulogne would also be helpful.

According to the revised EoE LW Loss List:

"4 September 1940 5./ZG76 Messerschmitt Bf110C-4 (3229). Forced-landed at Boulogne damaged by fighters in combat west of Tonbridge 1.45 p.m. Pilot unhurt, BF Uffz Paul Neumann believed wounded. Aircraft M8+KN 40% damaged but repairable."

I'm seeking a date, full code and possible pilot/crew for this Ju88A, which did a nose-stand at Stavanger-Sola perhaps around mid-April, 1940
 

Hello,

I'm seeking a date, full code and possible pilot/crew for this a/c, which did a nose-stand at Stavanger-Sola perhaps around mid-April, 1940.

The photos suggest that this may be 4D+AL of 3./KG30, which might well be the a/c of Hptm Arved Crüger Sta Kap, although he was not necessarily the pilot that day. Crüger may also not have normally flown the "A" aircraft in the Staffel. He was a Knight's Cross winner, and only the second member of KG30 to receive that award.

Detachments from 3 Staffel were operating from Sola during mid-April. Besides these three photos, which confirm the code 4D+A?, does anyone know of any other images of his incident that might confirm the 4th letter of the code, or have information that would allow a date to be put to this incident?

If this is 4D+AL, a previous aircraft with this code FL on an island off the coast of Denmark on 16.03.40, and was burned; the crew was interned. It was piloted by Uffz Siegfried Werner Matner, not Crüger. The Ju88A in these photos may have been the replacement for that a/c.

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-83J...-83JK7bC-M.jpg

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-N8Q...-N8Qzf2X-L.jpg

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-42G...-42Gk3vH-L.jpg

The first photo posted comes from this source:

http://www.fotonettverk-rogaland.no/...Forus-og-Sola/

The other two are eBay auction images. If anyone can provide original prints of any of these, it would be greatly apprecuated,

Any help would be appreciated.

Re: I'm seeking a date, full code and possible pilot/crew for this Ju88A, which did a nose-stand at Stavanger-Sola perhaps around mid-April, 1940
 

Hi Larry, i bougth the orginal ( 1 one ), but is forward to Jaermuseet. So it is not longer in my posetion. The code was not visable anyway.
I KG30 so it should be 4D + AH ( from the other two )
Regards
Ernst

Re: I'm seeking a date, full code and possible pilot/crew for this Ju88A, which did a nose-stand at Stavanger-Sola perhaps around mid-April, 1940
 

In my opinion, aircraft in question is not "4D+AH" and (Z)/KG 30 had been reserved staffel letter "H" - should be either 4D+AK or 4D+AL - but hard to tell, poor quality here - more likely 4D+AK (light red front half of spinners ?) I think damage be light (under 10%), likely never got into loss reports.

Ed

Seeking first names for two Stab KG77 Do17E Crewmen Shot down 03.09.39 during Polish Campaign
 

Hello,

Can anyone provide the first names of the two crewmen in our EoE LW loss entry below:

"3 September 1939: Stab KG77 Dornier Do17E. Port engine and wing tanks badly damaged in attack by Ppor. Marian Trzebinski of 161 EM over Chojnie, south-west of Lodz, and belly-landed at Neuhof, near Kreuzburg, 11.10 hrs. (Beo) Oberlt [ ] Otolski, (Ff) Oberlt [ ] Kaschna and rest of crew unhurt. Aircraft 3Z+FA damaged but repairable."

Re: Seeking first names for two Stab KG77 Do17E Crewmen Shot down 03.09.39 during Polish Campaign
 

Oskar Otolsky & Willy Kaschner???

Re: Seeking first names for two Stab KG77 Do17E Crewmen Shot down 03.09.39 during Polish Campaign
 

Hi,


Beobachter Oskar Otolski < correct spelling
* 02.12.1913 Aissehnen
+22.04.1945 near Pardubitz , RK 30.04.1945

Re: Seeking first names for two Stab KG77 Do17E Crewmen Shot down 03.09.39 during Polish Campaign
 

Chris & lilsis,

Thanx for your inputs. I've passed these on to Peter who is vacationing in France. Anybody else got anything to add?

Regards,

Need print for high res scan; Stab ZG2 Bf110 3M+AA, at Ste Marie AF, Chevigny, Belgium, circa 20-24.05.40.
 

Hello,

For profile purposes for the EoE Project we've got to locate an original print of this photo which shows a line up of Bf110s of Stab V.(Z)/LG1 (L1+XB & L1+YB) and, in the background, 3M+AA of the Gesch Stab of ZG2. The latter a/c is the Bf110, of Maj Friedrich Vollbracht, Geschwader Kommodore. We believe that this was taken at Ste Marie AF, near Chevigny, Belgium, sometime between 20 and 24 May 1940, the only period when these two units were apparently co-located together at this location. We're working on a profile series of the a/c of Stab ZG2, and need to be able to make a very high res image of Vollbracht's a/c to be able to view it in some detail. It appears to have had the fuselage sides over-sprayed with light blue (65) mottling.

We've searched for an original print of this photo through numerous collections, but only know of one place where this was published in a book, which is the source of this image. We're not aware of this being in the BA, ECPA or SH-D official collections, nor any of several major private collections that we've had access to, including that of Ludwig von Eimannsberger and John Vasco.

I'm also seeking photos of other Stab ZG2 aircraft during the period 01.04.40 (when the unit was activated) to the end of 09.40, when it was disbanded to become a night fighter unit. We have three photos of what is probably this same a/c force-landed on 04.09.40 in West Sussex during the Battle of Britain, piloted by the Gesch Adj. Those are the only other Stab ZG2 Bf110 photos of which we are aware.

Who can help us?

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-VBT...-VBT4vFd-L.jpg

Re: Need print for high res scan; Stab ZG2 Bf110 3M+AA, at Ste Marie AF, Chevigny, Belgium, circa 20-24.05.40.
 

Hello,

I've now located a better copy of this photo that was posted with an eBay auction about early April of 2004, some ten years ago. So a print of this is probably out there in the community somewhere. I don't know who either the original seller or the eBay buyer was. It provides a considerably better image of 3M+AA in the background, but I still need to locate an original print and scan that a/c at 600dpi to get a best image to work with for our profile. No question that a heavy overspray of 65 (light blue) had been applied to the side of the a/c, and a thicker black outline was added to the fuselage crosses.

Does anyone have an original print of this photo from which I can get a very high resolution, close-up image of 3M+AA?

Note that the caption, which indicates that this is certainly a PK photo released to the press, says that this is in France, but I still think that this is at Ste. Marie, Chevigny, AF, Belgium. If anyone has evidence to the contrary that would place this later in France, I'd appreciate seeing it.

http://ihra.smugmug.com/photos/i-Tzv...-TzvwgC6-L.jpg

Re: Need print for high res scan; Stab ZG2 Bf110 3M+AA, at Ste Marie AF, Chevigny, Belgium, circa 20-24.05.40.
 

Hi Larry,

I have visited the spot some weeks ago (end of May...). I confirm this is it. I found also bits of an Bf 110 crash-landed nearby.
There is a local publication, recently released, about it; showing those 110.

If interested, more to follow.

Best regards

ClinA-78

Re: Need print for high res scan; Stab ZG2 Bf110 3M+AA, at Ste Marie AF, Chevigny, Belgium, circa 20-24.05.40.
 

ClinA-78,

Thanx for responding. I appreciate your confirming this location. Yes, I'm interested in anything more that you can tell me, including any information that you have on the Bf110 that crashed nearby.

I'll await further word from you.

Re: Need print for high res scan; Stab ZG2 Bf110 3M+AA, at Ste Marie AF, Chevigny, Belgium, circa 20-24.05.40.
 

Hello Larry,

Here are two extracts of a recent book about May 1940 in the area. Sorry, I have only some bad copy sheets.
Here are the Bf 110's in Ourt-Sainte-Marie.