Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Page 8 has 10 entries, and I refer to them by the model etc as written by the Soviets. I have not altered the records to show information from the new source yet:

90. Ju 87D3 TROP WNr 2404:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=147556

91. Me 110G5 WNr 82225:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=161720

92. Me 109E7 U-1 WNr 5103:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=156758

93. Me 110F4 WNr 22718:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=147240

94. Me 110E2/N WNr 3938:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=155811

95. Ju 88A-4 WNr 4106:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=146993

96. Ju 88A-4 WNr 6716:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=146084

97. He 111-6 TROP WNr 7604:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=147346

98. Me 109E7 U-2 WNr 2030:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=142576

99. Ju 88A-4 WNr 5502:
http://www.aviationhistory.no/ref_db...?lossid=132030

Regards,

Andreas B

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Andreas, thank you a lot!!!

Best regards,
Andrey

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Wow! Thank you so much Andreas for this great work.

Vince...

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Andreas, a small blot in your excellent posts:

In the item 78 really the following plane:
Go145A WNr1524 DB+GO

Kind regards,
Andrey

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Andreas,

Let me add my congratulations to those of the others!

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Conclusion about "99 planes" episode.

As it turned out, the number was 98, not 99.

Items 43 and 61 are the same Hs123 WNr 2250. Obviously centerwing and tail part were in the different places.

So 98 planes:
A. 25 - with factory Nos, mentioned in German loss/damages lists and had 60%-100% damages in appropriate timeframe and location (consider 60% as the lower border for write-off though reality was more complicated a bit).
B. 50 - the same but with damages less than 60%.
C. 18 - with factory Nos, but isn’t mentioned in German loss/damages lists in appropriate timeframe and location.
D. 4 - without factory Nos but with board codes.
E. 1 - Hs129 without factory No and board code.

50+18 = 68 planes (items B and C) are the total losses due to enemy action unknown before the current discussion.
4+1 = 5 planes (items D and E) maybe unknown total losses too (partly or in whole).

For some of 4 planes (item D) identification is possible probably, as Andreas Brekken wrote:
It isn’t sole example of unknown losses in similar circumstances.
Another 55 planes from the same source (TsAMO, fund 500) but in more suitable form on Alexey Sergeev's page.
http://deruluft.livejournal.com/93454.html

Best regards,
Andrey

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Hi - Thanks for all your efforts here in bringing these documents to the forefront. So to keep the Post here fresh has any new information been discovered about other such Documents in Russian Archives

Thanks and Regards - Tom Willis

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Hello all,

new document from TsAMO:

http://wwii.germandocsinrussia.org/pages/837253/zooms/8
List of 24 Luftwaffe planes in repair or irrepairable on airfield Armawir (North Caucasus) 20.Jan.43 before evacuation.
Most of them were destroyed by Germans 22.Jan43. From this list probably only WNr.144110 and 144094 flew away. Red checked 5 Ju88 (almost serviceable) were destroyed. I think they are absent in GQM loss returns, many others possibly are absent too.

Bf109 WNr14225 listed in GQM returns as 35% 9.Jan43
Bf109 WNr.13866 listed as destroyed by Germans 2.Jan.43 - maybe typo?

Fi156 WNr.5089 listed as 35% 16.Jan.43 and 50% 18.Jan.43

Any additions and comments are welcomed.

Best regards,
Andrey

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Thank you for bringing this to everyone's attention, Andrey. Before stating that most of the aircraft listed in this document do not appear in the German loss records, I think it would be helpful to actually list the aircraft in question and let the specialists comment. I have typed up the document for this purpose, see below:

Re: List from TsAMO of 99 (!) German warplanes and 22 motors captured at the Chir (Tschir) station (Stalingrad area)
 

Hello Dan,

meticulous work, with one exception:

17. He111 is 7860, not 7360

Best regards,
Andrey