Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Please put it all back where it was

Regards

Martin

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

"Please put it all back where it was"

It wasn't anywhere in particular, it was all over the place.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Nick

Before it was all over the place but usable

Now it is all in one place and unworkable.

Order does not always equal efficiency

Please go with the suggestion of a folder and sub folders, like the ones in the book section for Jagdfliegerverbande etc

Regards

Martin

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

"Now it is all in one place and unworkable."

Give or take the search facility in the top menu bar, which I find very useful.

"Please go with the suggestion of a folder and sub folders."

I don't know how to do that (the job training for moderators is lousy), or if I have the authority but I'd hope Ruy would take that suggestion on board.

Re: Were either Bf109E-4s WNr3737 or 5915 manufactured with a DB-601N engine?
 

Nd what about Asmus fate.??

Rémi

Re: Seeing photos/info on 3.(F)/11 Do17P that FL & Burned on 11.01.40 near the French-German border
 

Larry


Edmund. Marin La Meslée

Edmond !!!

What about the date 11. or 13. ??

Rémi

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hello,

Seeking ID of an Uffz Schindler who flew Bf109E "Red 7" in an unknown unit during 1939. I know of a Fw Aadelbert Schindler who flew White 2 in 4./JG52 in 1940, but I doublt if it's the same guy.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Dear Larry,

An answer has been posted in LRG. Did you read it?

Best regards, Franck.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi Larry, would love to hear a bit of a 'state of the nation' on the project. Looking forward to your team's production.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi,

An update on the current progress of the EOE project will be posted when Larry has time to write a comprehensive piece outlining where we are at. Should be fairly soon, time permitting! So please check back here on TOCH for updates.

We have request too! If there are any aircraft profile artists that could take on the aircraft types required for the Polish airforce during 1939 we would be glad to hear from you. We will require highly accurate port, starboard, top and partial bottom, front views. Anyone interested in discussing this further can send me a personal message and I will get back to you asap.

Regards,

Aviart
IHRA Art Director

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Also artists for French, Italian, and Belgium types for the 1939 - end of 1940 period.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

It appears that the messaging system on my account is not working.

Could any interested artists please contact us at the following email address:

artwork.ihra@gmail.com

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi Larry, its been quite a long time since we had an update on the EOE project.
Are you able to give any news?

Best regs,
Steve.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

What is the current status of the project? I think it is time for an update. It would seem that we should start to see publications soon

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Del I agree. Larry a lot of people on this board have helped you on this project with time and photos and information . I think you owe them and update.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Polite question, John, is he even still on here? His oldest post in this thread was some years ago...

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

You're right Nick.
One must/Schould ask LRG !
As aside comment:
Larry did stop to post here in TOCH when one thought very wise to put all Larry threads in only one without asking or warning him. Following one question/subject/machine turned to be impossible. Hence ...
Regards,
Franck.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi all,

Larry is very busy so I would like to give you an update on his behalf.
The manuscript is ready till 9.9.39. Maps are ready for a few first days. Now we are producing Luftwaffe aircraft profiles and started to create Polish aircraft profiles (we are waiting for the first). We set a deadline for the first part of the Polish Campaign book for 31.12.2018 (so any major text corrections or additions could be not done beyond this date). After this date the manuscript will be edited and adjust to our book format (page count for 1.9.39: 508). So I think the first volumen of Polish Campaign will be out next year.
During the last year we managed to acquire a major collection of Polish aircraft photos and this was very important move for our project.
Simultaneously we are working on Sitzkrieg and Norwegian Campaign so these books should be ready in quick succesion.
We are still looking for loogbooks, photos, memories, diaries etc. fitting in our timeframe.

Regards

Robert Szoltyk

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi Robert,


Thank you for this update. I do not know what Larry and company are going through to complete this series. I realize it is a huge undertaking. Perhaps we could get a list of a few specific logbooks that are needed which would help others help Larry and his team. We don't know what you have and what is missing or needed.


Just my thoughts.


Regards,
Ed West

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi Ed, that's a great idea by the way.
Thank you Robert for the much long awaited update.

Best regs,
Steve

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

I have been warned against posting personal comments and opinions here, even though everyone else does it and nothing is said, but I am going to take a chance here. If you have ever seen Larry Hickey's:
Hickey, Lawrence J. Warpath Across the Pacific: The Illustrated History of the 345th Bombardment Group During World War II. Eagles Over the Pacific, Volume I. Boulder (CO): International Research and Publishing Corp., 4th ed., 1996. ISBN: 0 913511 02 1. 500+ Photos. Color profiles. Maps. Bibliography. Index,
then you know he produces an outstanding book, unsurpassed, in fact. But if you have known him for nearly 20 years like I have, you know that he always uses his rather unique team approach and never establishes parameters for his book projects. What he says will be finished and brought to market in 5 years ends up taking 10-12 years or longer to complete. Back in the very early 2000's, he told many of us that Eagles Over the Pacific would eventually have 18 to 20 or more volumes. But he lost interest in the Pacific Theater somewhere along the way after completing just 2 of his big "project" volumes, I think, Warpaths and Rampage.

So, from personal experience, I would caution all of you that you have a long, long wait before an Eagles Over Europe volume appears. Additionally, Larry Hickey is almost my age (80), so he is getting on and may not have the good health and high energy needed in a few more years to finish these huge undertakings. Like you, I hope he does.

L.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Thank you for posting this Larry. I've been in the fiction book publishing business for 30 years. I know how things can change and so on. I wish you, Larry and his team all the best.



Ed

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Thank you ,Robert, for the update. It is certainly good news that the project is moving toward publication. Like Larry, I am well aware of the promises of the Eagles over the Pacific project made in the 1990s and still not realized. I had hoped that EoE would not suffer the same fate and therefore have periodically asked for an update which I thought was due to the members of this board. I am only approaching 70 and still have hopes to see both EoP and EoE completed

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Another 8 months have passed and still there is nothing published. Can we expect to see something in 2019?

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi Del,

manuscript for 1.9.39 is finished - there are approx. 600 pages of text, which must be edited and adjusted to our book format. Maps are finished and we are working on aircraft profiles. We are still looking for some photos! So if anyone could help us in this subject it will be greatly appreciated.
On the other side I`m now finishing manuscript for 14.9.39 - more than 120 pages.

Regards

Robert

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hello Robert,

What specific types of photos are you looking for?

Best,
Ed

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Hi,

aircraft (Luftwaffe, Polish Air Force), emblems, crashes, men, airfields and attack assessment photos.

Regards

Robert

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

I will leave two links here which will be of interest to those who are following Eagles over Europe project and the other endeavours coordinated by Larry Hickey.

Four books of the Eagles over the Pacific series are listed as available and five as 'in production'.

https://irandpcorp.com/current-projects-2/

There is also a blog with relatively regular posts about the air war over the Pacific, presumably using material collected during the course of the Eagles over the Pacific project.

https://airwarworldwar2.wordpress.com/

Kind regards,

Dan

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Let us face it (and be brave): it is very unlikely that we will ever hold one of these dozens of very exciting, fascinating volumes in the series "Eagles over Europe" (EOE) "in our greedy hands". One or two volumes at best: Polish Campaign 1939, if at all.

Quite obviously my friend, our friend Larry Hickey is very ill. Before he was he often posted several messages right here within one day - now nothing at all. He didn't need anybody else to write on his behalf (or not). I think he wrote several hundred emails to me before he was ill. Many of these were long or very long. We often discussed particular matters at length and in-depth.

Larry spent very large sums of his own personal money on this project, which is very commendable - his great efforts and his huge amount of work for many years, and his devotion too.

Possibly all these efforts and these large sums of money are not really lost for it is certainly possible to publish several volumes containing photographs with captions as well as color profiles and maps (I think at least part of them do exist by now). Larry also had many German texts including a very long one (written by Weiss?) on the 1940 French Campaign translated into English. A book or two containing these translations (and photographs) would most probably be a success.

Well Larry, if you can read this, your friends and your fans are not forgetting you and they'd like to know how you are.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

A point I forgot to mention: Larry is one of the very few Americans who showed real interest in the European part of World War II. This is very commendable too (he showed he was a real historian who realized the enormous significance of this war in Europe). No other person, not even a German, French, British or other person, ever published, or attempted to publish, such a giant, comprehensive historical work on the air war in Europe from September 1939 through December 1940, or for any period of WW II. Jochen Prien's giant series on German fighter units is something entirely different - and very useful and interesting too.

Larry thought that his OEO volumes would not be profitable so he would lose money, probably a large sum. I disagreed and I still disagree. In my humble opinion there is a good market for such high-quality, very valuable historical works. I think it would at least break even but most probably be really profitable. Appropriate publicity could be necessary - and fully justified. For example I feel the volumes on the French Campaign (10 May-24 June 1940) would sell at least 5,000 copies, probably much more for precisely this period of the AIR war was, and still is, neglected or ignored by historians although it was at least as significant as the Battle of Britain, which happened to be the last 1940 air battle and thus was a decisive event. Larry was about to close this gap - much to many people's delight.

Crossing fingers for Larry.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

The French (sic) campaign neglected or ignored by historians?

Have you not seen Peter Cornwell's work on that period?

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Oh yes. It was released 2008, only 68 years after the fighting (almost all those who had been involved in it had died long ago). Not Peter Cornwell's fault - he did a very commendable job and his book is very good and very useful.

I think since 1940 about 37,000,000 books were published on the Battle of Britain, which admittedly is an important and interesting subject too, not to mention millions of books on other aerial campaigns.

Sorry John but I have an important business to attend in the next few days. Please don't wait for me to keep commenting on this.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

1. And your point is...?


2. Again, and your point is...? Note to self: Got a lot to catch up on those millions of books...


3. I will be interested to see your further comments on points '1' & '2' of your post I have quoted above. I've got all the time in the world...

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

See my "personal comments and opinion" Post #341 on page 35 of this thread.

Although I certainly hope Larry H. is not severely ill and recovers soon, I nevertheless feel that my prediction in #341 was spot on.

So, Mr. rof120, your first paragraph in your post of 7th March is perhaps the wildest, most unsubstantiated and totally incorrect comment I have yet to read on this forum since I joined it in 2001. Except for the first sentence, your second paragraph was equally off the mark.

I feel very sad for the numerous people who expended their time and talent on this project in that they will most like never see it completed.

L.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

- I'll reply as soon as I can. Meantime:

John Vasco :

“The French (sic) campaign neglected or ignored by historians?”

Why not French ? You seem to take exception to this name but this campaign took place mainly in and over France even if some very important German operations took place in the NL and Belgium. It’s just a general habit in history to name campaigns or battles after the place or region where they, or their main part, took place. In the English books I own they often call it the “French” Campaign too. It’s simply logical. If you care to have a look inside a few British books on this subject or on the whole of WW II you’ll notice very quickly.

Besides, Peter Cornwell gave the very book you mentioned the following title: “The Battle of France Then and Now” (according to a tradition by “After the Battle” and himself). No “France (sic)”. In this particular case the title is quite wrong (which doesn’t matter) for the French Campaign (not Battle even if W. Churchill used this phrase) started first on May 10, 1940 with the all-out German offensive. As far as I know historians call the fighting starting on June 5 “The Battle of France” for it took place exclusively on and above French territory (starting along and across the Somme and Aisne rivers). The period from May 10 through June 4 is simply the first phase, or period, of the French Campaign. Both periods together (May 10-June 24) are the French Campaign.

German people call it mostly “der Westfeldzug” (a nice mouthful), the West(ern) Campaign, but often, too, “der Frankreichfeldzug”, as many German books and reviews I own show. “Westfeldzug” is perfectly all right from the German point of view for virtually all the fighting took place in the West (seen from Germany), partly Southwest (the deep French territory). British people could call it “The campaign in the South” for the same geographical reasons but they don’t. How would YOU call it, if not “The French campaign”? I suspect you admire the Luftwaffe, especially their Me 110s, so much that you adopt every German phrase including “The Campaign in the West”. To British people the vast expanses of space in the West of Great Britain are called Atlantic Ocean. By the way, French fighter pilots including Czechs and Poles claimed no less than 56 “sure” victories on Me 110s (248 were engaged in combat) plus about 20 “probable” ones, and FRENCH victories were filtered, checked and officially confirmed or rejected – the latter did happen.

You seem to have a high opinion of P. Cornwell’s book. So do I. If you care to have a look at PC’s own “Introduction” on page 6 you’ll find “the campaign in France” (5th line of text). On page 7 you’ll find “the French Campaign” (6th line). If you disagree with the phrase “French Campaign” you disagree with Peter Cornwell and his TBFTN. Page 7 too, 1st line of 3rd paragraph: “the campaign in France”. Same paragraph, 3 last lines: “… was consulted at the National Archives at Kew, the RAF narrative of the Campaign in France proving an excellent source”… (italics by P. Cornwell). Obviously, accepting “the campaign in France” but not “the French Campaign” would be unserious stubbornness and quibbling and I’m sure you’re not the type to behave like that.

In my first post I mentioned that I immediately warned Larry for the immense quantity of facts and data on the 1940 French Campaign. I think he realized how terribly right I was but only belatedly : he didn’t believe me at first. So the quantity of work to be done by him was much larger than he had bargained for: the Polish campaign, however brave the Poles and fierce the fighting were, was short and aircraft losses relatively few (a few hundred ones). The Battle of Britain had been thoroughly researched long ago, including by his right hand Peter Cornwell, and, like everybody, he strongly underestimated the air fighting during the French Campaign with an actual total of lost aircraft from all countries much higher than in the Battle of Britain (BoB: 2,910 AC from both countries, and a few from Italy, were lost according to the same P. Cornwell) : well over 4,000 AC were lost in the Fr. Camp., and the subject had been hardly researched thoroughly yet, according to his philosophy (and he wanted to collect and publish every possible detail on every loss including all details on crew members). As German people use to say, “das war eine harte Nuss zu knacken” – it was a hard nut to krack.

On page 6 too (bottom of first column) P. Cornwell, who had accepted this task when asked by “After the Battle”, admits to have been “little appreciating the sheer enormity and complexities of the task ahead.” These are more or less my own words when I warned Larry but his project was even much more enormous and complex – probably unrealistic, which is a great pity.

About 10 days ago I emailed my first post in this thread to Larry. He didn’t reply and I think he’ll never do. Clearly he’s very ill for when he was more or less in good health he would reply immediately or at least very quickly.

Crossing fingers for him.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

rof120,
First of all, I would venture to suggest I know Peter Cornwell better than you.

So, in terms of the title of 'BoFT&N', of course I mentioned it to him and we had a chat and a laugh about it.

The undeniable fact, however, is that not only France was attacked on 10th May 1940. Other countries on mainland Europe were also.

"...I suspect you admire the Luftwaffe, especially their Me 110s, so much that you adopt every German phrase including “The Campaign in the West”..." If you ask anyone who knows me, you will find out that over the decades I have a realistic hard-nosed approach to research. It is grounded in seeking out facts, and the supporting information. And then to present it for public consumption without fear or favour. I take no side whatsoever with regard to research. The last three sentences of the Preface to my book 'Sting of the Luftwaffe' states: "This work seeks neither to glorify what took place, nor to take sides on any issue. It is simply the photographic record of young men. This is their silent story, not mine." Make of it what you will. On a personal note, I am 100% thankful that we survived the onslaught in 1940 (and the lesser onslaught in the following years) and were ultimately victorious in 1945, in concert with other nations.

My interest in the Bf 110 evolved from my first research work on Erprobungsgruppe 210, which unit had predominently Bf 110s. That, and undertaking joint research work on the Bf 110 in 1940 with Peter, led me to the point I am at today. Nothing more complicated than that.

I agree with you re the size of the EoE Project. I warned Larry about it when he visited me in October 2006. I fear for this Project ever reaching complete fruition, as I believe you do also. I e-mailed Larry a couple or more weeks ago and like you, have had no response. I'm with you in hoping for the best for him.

I hope the foregoing explains things in better detail for you.

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

e: The Eagles Over Europe Project
________________________________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by rof120

1. Oh yes. It was released 2008, only 68 years after the fighting (almost all those who had been involved in it had died long ago). Not Peter Cornwell's fault - he did a very commendable job and his book is very good and very useful.

2. I think since 1940 about 37,000,000 books were published on the Battle of Britain, which admittedly is an important and interesting subject too, not to mention millions of books on other aerial campaigns.

1. And your point is...?

- Is obvious. It’s a great pity that no COMPREHENSIVE story of the aerial part of the Fr. Campaign was written before all the survivors passed away. Obviously it was the French’s responsibility to do the job. I understand the French Defence historical branch (Service historique de la Défense) in the Château at Vincennes (close to East-Paris) published some documents and books. I have to admit that I don’t know the details on these yet. They also made recordings of numerous survivors talking on their experiences. A great big book like Peter Cornwell’s should have been published in France itself decades ago – 1960-70 would have been a good time frame, 1970-80 would have been allright too. 2000 was too late already for those who were aged 20 in 1940 were 80 years old in 2000, 85 if they were 25 in 1940, and many of them were no longer among us.

There are relatively numerous French books on the subject but each book covers only a little part of it, like some excellent monographs on aircraft types published by Éditions Larivière (Docavia series) and by Lela Presse. They contain good summaries of war operations too. As usual all over the world most books are devoted to fighters and fighter units. I feel nobody will ever be able to change the general fascination mostly for fighter aircraft and fighter boys. Let us accept this as a fact of life.

In my eyes there is a special case : both little books published 1941 and 1942 by “Capitaine Accart”, who 1940 was a captain (corresponding a Flight Lieutenant with the RAF) and led a fighter “escadrille” of 12 fighters, of which a maximum of 9 flew at the same time (more or less corresponding an RAF fighter squadron with 16/12 AC). His escadrille was the by very far top-scoring one among 52 others with twice as many victories as the next ranking unit (n° 2) and he was one of the top-scoring Allied fighter pilots although he was very seriously wounded on 1 June 1940 and spent the rest of the campaign in hospital (23 days, half the total time). He was an extremely clever, brave, generous and modest man. He very nearly was killed twice by rear-gunners of German bombers or recce AC. The 2nd time he actually received a machine-gun bullet, fired at short range, exactly between his eyes. He survived by the skin of his teeth to become a very high-ranking 4-star general (French star system with 2-5 stars) in the 1960s and 1970s with the French Air Force, NATO etc. He never received his 5th star because he disagreed with de Gaulle (then the French President) on a strategic matter. He was one of very few French men having said “No” to de Gaulle directly into his face. He left the AF and retired.

In his first booklet, “Chasseurs du ciel” (Hunters of the Sky, 1941) he reported mainly his personal part and his unit’s part of the fighting. The second booklet, “On s’est battu dans le ciel” (There was Fighting in the Sky), gives general explanations on the air war, especially combat by fighters, its rules and possibilities and what was not possible (roughly: giving every single French infantryman (there were well over one million of these) his very own, personal fighter aircraft and pilot to protect him 24 hours a day against the naughty Stukas – the bitter irony is mine not his). His explanations on tactics and strategy are “smack on target” and mostly still valid today. This is an excellent fundamental text on aerial warfare. In both booklets some inaccuracies are the result of inevitable poor information at the time on German AC etc. – these matters were still hush-hush. Everybody who wants to research the 1940 French Campaign should read, among other things, this remarkable booklet, sold on the Internet for about 5 euros.

2. Again, and your point is...? Note to self: Got a lot to catch up on those millions of books...

My point is obvious again. It is perfectly all right that so many books were, and will be, published on the Battle of Britain (many are good to excellent – not all of them), quite a few in foreign languages including many in French or in German. I feel French authors writing on the BoB ought to write on the Fr. Campaign instead – but they couldn’t use those millions of books already published in English on the BoB… They often betray that they just copied some English sources, mostly a few books (or only one) when they use the English word “Mark” for German hardware, like “Panzer Mark II” (or Mark III, IV). You’ll never find “Mark” in this meaning in a German text, except possibly about English or American hardware. German people write simply “Panzer I, II, III, IV” and so on. One of those misguided, phoney French “historians”, who is very famous and very successful, writes mostly nonsense and wants us to believe that RAF Bomber Command used Mosquitoes and Lancasters 1940. This is just a small sample.

The aerial part of the French Campaign was in no way a sideshow, as almost everybody in the world believes. The total losses of aircraft from all waring parties were higher by more than 1,000 than in the Battle of Britain but in less than half the time (35 days of actual fighting in the 46 days of the campaign as compared to 83 days from July 10 through September 30, October not being really part of the actual BoB). In the French Campaign Germany lost 1,460 aircraft (according to P. Cornwell’s figures), which is about the same figure as in the BoB but in half the time at most, so the fighting was much harder and much more bitter for the Germans over France than over GB.

The point? It’s a shame that no comprehensive book tells this story, at least the French part of it, which quite naturally was much larger (except possibly for British bombers) and above all much longer (totalling the famous 46 days) than the British part (very little after the end of “Dunkirk”-Operation Dynamo on June 3).

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Three more months and not a word...

I know someone who has been bounced off another forum for daring to question the progress of the EOE Project.

In fact, I know of TWO. No names, no pack drill, though...

Don't any of you dare say it will never come to fruition...

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

:) :)

Nooooo, really ?

Re: The Eagles Over Europe Project
 

Yeeeeessss. Really.

I kid thee not!