Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Good night to all.
I am searching more information about the Flight made by Major Heinz-Wolfgang Schaufer on 1st March 1945 at Güntersloh on a Dornier Do 335 single seat fighter.
Could someone or does someone know the Werknummer or codes of this machine? I heard the Dornier engineers were also present, as well as Dornier test pilots. Anyone heard about that and could add more information? ( names of engineers, or test pilots )?
Yours
Adriano

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hello,

Were did you get the info from that Schnaufer flew a Do 335 on 1st March 1945?
In the logbook of Schnaufer is noted that he flew a Do 335, number or code unknown, on the 24 February 1945 and again on the 25 February 1945. On both flights it was a two-seater, the second crewmember was his 1.Wart Ullrich (24 Feb.) and a certain Dobenschutz (25 Feb). Schnaufer took off from Gütersloh and landed there also on both flights, although it was only a matter of minutes that he flew the Do 335.
And I can only conclude that it was the Do 335 - V 10 in which Schnaufer flew. Fritz Rumpelhardt remembered that this Do 335 was transferred to I./NJG 3 in the vicinity of Hamburg. Is this correct? I do not know.
Since 1999, I have been researching the career of Schnaufer, a new book about this research has been published (in Flemish/Dutch). Fot further info see at www.heinzschnaufer.be

All the best,

Wim

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hello Wim! Thanks for answering and adding a lot of interesting information about Schaufer´s flight on the Do 335. The information I got came from a report from Hauptmann Hans Krause ( Kommandeur I/NJG 4 ) on his participation during Operation Gisela. On his own account he remembers that he was called by Schnauffer on 1st March 1945 and that he was due to carry a Dornier Do 335 flight ( single seater ) as well as a test on the FuG 280 Kiel. From his own words, he flew after Schnaufer, taking off from Gütersloh, as you correctly mentions. They both flew around the base for about only 30 minutes. Krause says that he found the aircraft fantastic, although it was unsuited for Zahme Sau tactics, for lacking a second man and further radar/radio instalation. This is why I asked about 1st March 1945. I do not know IF this is the correct date. I am basing my information on the own words and account of Hptm Krause. A famous HISTORIAN and researcher is writing about and does have the logbooks of Krause. I had to check with him IF this was the correct date. Very nice to hear that another book on Schnaufer will be published. Wish you good luck and success. I will try to comunicate with that UK Historian and ask him about Krause´s logbooks as well. If I had more information I will be only glad to share with you. Sincerely yours Adriano

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

All

According to the book Dornier 335 Arrow (Monogram) Fritz Rumpelhardt is stated to have said that Schnaufer crashed the A-1 WNr 240113 at Gütersloh. This aeroplane was later captured in a damaged state. No date is quoted.

Cheers
Stig

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

...but according to "Dornier Do335 Pfeil" by Smith & Creek [pp85, Classic 2006]

"One story that is definitely wrong, possibly instigated by Lt.Fritz Rumplehardt, radio operator to the night-fighter ace Wolfgang Schnaufer, is that the young ace damaged the Do335 in a heavy landing at Gutersloh"

Kind regards

Peter D Evans
LEMB Administrator

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hello Adriano,

Hptm Krause's logbook states that on the 1st March 1945 he was in Vechta were he arrived on the 28th February. Only on the evening (1843 hours) of the 1st March he came back to Gütersloh. No doubt that David P. Williams can confirm this.
It is well possible that Krause remembered the flight of Schnaufer in the Do 335 of the 25th February. Krause took off that morning in Gütersloh at 0745 hours, for testing Ju 88 3C+BC, but by that time Schnaufer was already back on the ground as he landed the Do 335 at 0742 hours that same morning.
Fritz Rumpelhardt never stated that Schnaufer crashed a Do 335, perhaps this was lost somewhere in the translation.
All the best,

Wim

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Peter
Lovely! The same authors deny their own story 10 years later...:rolleyes:

Wim
No idea what Fritz said or did not say. All I did was quoting from the book stated. The way the authors wrote it, it sounded like they had interviewed Rumpelhardt at the time. But since they could not spell his name right in 1997 and not 10 years later, their reliabillity is a bit dubious. If it is a translation it must be a very bad one if a translator interpret things totally the opposite way. And why would Rumpelhardt say that Schanufer did NOT crash any Do 335 at all, unless it was talked about?

Would be interesting to know who damaged the 335 in question? Maybe the one who started the rumours...:)

Cheers
Stig

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hey there Stig...

Of course, the latest Classic book would usually give the authors the chance to update info and amend mistakes. However, from a conversation with one of the authors of the Monogram work, he told me that they had very little to do with the work even though his name appeared on the cover and that his name was used without his permission! He also advised me that the Classic work was a "completely new book on the Do 335 that will destroy much of what has gone before" (his words not mine) ;)

Great discussion anyway... and thanks to Wim for his excellent input too... :)


Cheers

Peter D Evans
LEMB Administrator

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hello all,

in his book "Meine Geschichte und die meiner Familie", published in 2002, Rumpelhardt mentions this flight. He clearly states that the english authors must have misinterpreted him.
"Soon after this flight another pilot flew the plane to I./NJG 3 in the hamburg area where he allegedly bellylanded it."
He gives no clear date - only speaks of a Sunday morning.
Also he says that they (Schnaufer and Rumpelhardt) only intended to fly the Do 335 together but this never happend.

Have a nice evening

NoNo

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hello Stig, Nono and Peter.
I heard about Do 335 V-10 being flown by Luftwaffe night-fighter pilots ( werknummer 230010, factory number CP+UK ), but WHEN the airplane still was a single-seater at Diepensee on 24th January 1945 (?! Did this information matches? I, however, do not know the names of pilots involved ).
From Krause´s account ( It is a pity that my other computer is down, otherwise I would have scanned his own account in German ), it really seems HE FLEW the Dornier 335 for around 30 minutes - After Schnaufer.
I was afraid, and WIM correctly checked, that after more than 50 years ( we all knows how memory play tricks on us, so we can imagine that after so many combat missions and stress, it is fair common to misjudge dates and facts for a former Luftwaffe pilot ) HE could have made a mistake on the date of his flight.
WIM, do you have access to Krause´s logbooks? Could you check IF there is an entry for a Do 335 flight?
The book "Ace of Diamonds" by Hinschlife, mentions the "landing accident" that you already reported here, remembered by Rumplehardt. However, Hans Krause did not mention it on his account. If any kind of misfortune should have happened, and he mentions that there were Dornier engineers and test pilots around - it would be easier to remember than the actual date of his flight on the PFEIL ( IF he ever flew it ).
I also read on Gebhard Aders classic "The history of the German night-fighter force 1917-45" that there was a Special Commission ( whose name I cannot remember by heart now ) detailed to check the most interesting night-fighters, those who had to have absolute priority. I remember reading that the Ju 388 was discarded in favour of the Ar-234 and Do-335. ( Had to check on the book, otherwise I will be writing wrong things here. ). Well, my main doubt: Have KRAUSE flown the Do 335?
The other good question was already asked by NoNo: Who damaged the 240113 machine, as mentioned?

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hi All,
Do 335 240113 had a collision with a Bf 109 that damaged the rear tail, airfield unknown. The pilot was Karl-Heinz Appel and he was unhurt. The aircraft was found by US troops at Bindlach in a hangar. How it got there is unclear. Source: Do 335 by Classic Pub.

Regards,

Norbert

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

I will check the Griehl book about the Do-335, because there are major deviations between Griehls book and the new Classic volume regarding certain V-Muster and Werknummern...

will post what I find out then...

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

There is even a picture of the aircraft 240113 on page 76 of the Classic book. According to the authors Schnaufer never flew the Do 335. This particular aircraft was slated to be converted to a two seater but the collision with the Bf 109 prevented this.

Norbert

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Hello Adriano,

I would love to see the account of Krause, as in his logbook there is no such flight in a Do 335 recorded.
All the best,

Wim

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Thanks Guys

This became a much more interesting discussion than I thought initially.
Since the authors Smith,Creek and Hitchcock first published their expanded Monogram book in 1997 they could not have misinterpreted any memoir from Rumpelhardt published in 2002. Their (by now denied) story about Schnaufer crashing his Do 335 must have come from elsewhere.

Peter
Looks like I have to get the Classic Do 335 book after all:) Never heard of a book before where an author denies writing it without taking any action against the publisher. I doubt you are talking about Mr Hitchcock...

Norbert
Again looks like I have to get the Classic book....

Cheers
Stig

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

...it certainly wasn't Thomas, and I've never had any correspondence with J. Richard Smith... that ought to narrow down the list ;)

Cheers

Peter D Evans
LEMB Administrator

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

I'm sorry if I'm repeating what I said here or on Peter's forum - I forget which - but Smith & Creek wrote a Monogram Close-Up (36-page softback) on the Do 335 that came out in 1983. Tom Hitchcock later added material to expand it into a hardback book, crediting them and himself as the authors.

Obviously the Classic volume is worth every penny because it includes two colour photos I took of the unrestored Do 335 at the NASM Silver Hill facility in 1973! (And I still kick myself for not photographing their Bf 109 which was being spray-painted that day).

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Wim and others,
Since all this started with an account of Hptm Hans Krause, I do promiss that as soon as I got my other computer fixed down, I will scan the initial part of the manuscript I received from him ( sorry but in German ). As I had imagined, and as those of you guys, who had access to his logbook had showed us the factual evidences, it seems that NO flight either from Krause or Schnaufer was made on the 1st March 1945.
I, off course, could have contracted a BAD translator down here in Brazil; but I guess he managed to translate almost everything all right...
Please wait until Friday at the most - when I will have my computer fixed. Today is holliday in Brazil, so nobody works...
Yours friendly ( and still learning from nice people and well known writers...always, like LEMB motto... )
Adriano

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Stig,

of course Smith, Creek and Hitchcock could not misinterpret a book published five years after there own.
Rumpelhardt wrote about a "english statement" he has on hand where he was completely misconstrued.
Possibly the 1997 Do 335 Classic book.

Hope that helps

NoNo

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

HERE from Hptm Johannes "Hans" Krause letter to me in the late 90's>


Am 1. März 1945 bat mich der Kommodore, nach Gütersloh zu fahren, einer Stadt oberhalb von Dortmund, wo sich der Stab der NJG 4 befand, damals war ich bei der I Gruppe in Vechta. Wir stiegen mit meiner Crew in einer Junkers Ju 88 G-6 ein und flogen nach Gütersloh. Dort teilte uns Major Heinz Wolfgang Schnaufer, unser Kommodore, mit, dass wir ein neues Radargerät ausprobieren sollten und einen Experimentierflug mit einem Dornier Do 335 Pfeil machen würden. Die Version, die sie uns mit der Maschine zur Verfügung stellten, hatte einen einzigen Sitz für den Piloten. Der Dornier Do 335 hatte einen Motor mit Frontmotor und einen Motor mit Heckmotor im gleichen Rumpf. Den Anweisungen der Dornier Testfahrer folgend machte Major Schnaufer einen 30-minütigen Flug. Es gelang mir, und ich machte auch einen 30-minütigen Flug um die Basis herum. Die Geschwindigkeit dieses Flugzeugs hat mich wirklich beeindruckt. Er war, wie damals gesagt wurde, das schnellste Propellerflugzeug der Welt. Ungewöhnlich für uns war die Landung mit Bugfahrwerk (Die Junkers Ju 88 sowie die Bf 110 G-4 hatten konventionelle Fahrwerke) und mit dem Schleudersitz, den wir Gott sei Dank nicht verwenden müssen. (Anmerkung des Verfassers: Der Heinkel He 219 sowie der Dornier Do 335 waren mit Vogt-Wissemann-Auswerfersitzen, hergestellt von Dräger) ausgestattet. Leider für uns, die mit "Zahme Sau" -Missionen geflogen sind, entsprach diese Einzelsitzversion nicht den Interessen des Nachtjägers. Wir brauchten mindestens einen zweiten Sitz, so dass ein anderes Funksystem und ein Bordradar installiert und von einem zweiten Mann bedient wurden. Nach bestem Wissen hat Dornier zwei Exemplare des Dornier Do 335-Doppelmodells (eines davon das V-10) hergestellt. aber keiner von ihnen wurde vor Kriegsende in irgendeinem Nachtjagdkommando einsatzbereit

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

I forgot to follow up the thread, 17 years ago...and I had promissed the text of the letter I received...so here it is...albeit a bit later.

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Thanks

Re: Do 335 flight by Schnaufer on 1st March 1945
 

Translation by Google translate:


"On March 1, 1945, the commodore asked me to go to Gütersloh, a town above Dortmund, where the headquarters of NJG 4 was located; at that time I was with I Group in Vechta. We boarded a Junkers Ju 88 G-6 with my crew and flew to Gütersloh. There, Major Heinz Wolfgang Schnaufer, our commodore, told us that we should try out a new radar device and do an experimental flight with a Dornier Do 335 Pfeil. The version they provided us with the plane had a single seat for the pilot. The Dornier Do 335 had a front-engined engine and a rear-engined engine in the same fuselage. Following the instructions of the Dornier test drivers, Major Schnaufer made a 30-minute flight. I succeeded and also took a 30 minute flight around the base. The speed of this plane really impressed me. It was, as was said at the time, the fastest propeller plane in the world. What was unusual for us was the landing with nose gear (the Junkers Ju 88 and the Bf 110 G-4 had conventional landing gear) and with the ejection seat, which thank God we don't have to use. (Author's note: The Heinkel He 219 and the Dornier Do 335 were equipped with Vogt-Wissemann ejector seats, manufactured by Dräger). Unfortunately for those of us who flew "Zahme Sau" missions, this single-seat version did not suit the night fighter's interests. We needed at least a second seat, so a different radio system and onboard radar were installed and operated by a second man. To the best of our knowledge, Dornier produced two examples of the Dornier Do 335 twin model (one of which was the V-10). but none of them became operational in any night fighter command before the end of the war."