Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Anyone seen this book? Reviews? There is an excerpt on Osprey´s site that makes one´s expectations plummet as the claim of unsupercharged AM-38 is still there. And such BS from a graduate of their Air Academy.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Hello Jukka!

I have awaited this volume for a long time, but wisely I browsed through it before buying it blind.
the text I read, chosen at random throughout the books seems to be quite nice, as are the photos, but thats about it;
the colour profiles look way too flat IMHO, compared to the works of other artists, the planes shown in the profiles are not even given their correct designations (I know that those are IL-2s, but I want to know which sub-type they are as well).

the best part of the book IMHO again are the line drawings of the different IL-2 subtypes on the last pages of this volume.

I do seriously hope that the upcoming MIG-15 Aces of Korea volume is better than this volume.
Do not get me wrong-for anyone interested in the Sturmovik or for starters, this is quite a nice work but for its asking price, it offers too little IMHO

hope this helps
cheers
phil

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Phil, I don´t give a fertilizer about colour profiles. It wouldn´t disturb me one moment if all colour profiles in the world turned black tomorrow.

But whether or not an aviation author undersatnd some engine basics matters a lot to me. And if one claims that the AM-38 did not have a supercharger, he is in error.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

I suppose this is because author provided with the correct designation.
Shturmovik stands for ground-attack aircraft, nothing else.
I cannot comment on this particular title, but reading Ratrenin/Perov's Il-2 monography, I would say it was one of the best if not best aircraft monography I have ever seen.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Jukka:

What for that supercharger was need? For better characters on hight altitude, yep?

Il-2 - low level flying aircraft, no need supercharger :)

Griffon:

As far as I know, there are only FEW designations of that aircraft. Not as in polish monography (there were NO "Il-2type3" or "Il-2M" or other BS).

As far as I know:
Il-2 AM-38 with ShVAK, Il-2 AM-38 with VYa,
Il-2 AM-38 two seater, Il-2 AM-38F two seater, Il-2 AM-38F with NS-37,
Il-2 AM-38F with arrow wing.

Also, as far as I know, in almost all documents there are only two subtypes: Il-2 AM-38 (one- or two seater never described) and Il-2 AM-38F. Thats all.

Yes, Franek:

I have several of his books, and I can say that he is a really best author on Shturmovik subject. He have access to factory documents, archive documents of Il-2 regiments, claims, losses, e.t.c. Photoes, films...

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Hello!

I have thought that the "F" in AM-38F stands for supercharged (Forsirovanniy) !?

Looking forward the Osprey book.


Kari

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

AM-38 (АМ-38F)
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...lin_AM-38F.jpg
Specification

Cubic capacity, l - 46.66
Compression ratio - 6
Weight, kg - 880
Engine power (takeoff regime), h.p. - 1700
Rotation frequency (takeoff regime), 2350
Engine power at earth level, h.p. - 1500
Engine power at altitude, h.p. - 1500
Specific weight, kg - 0.59
Liter power, h.p./l. - 32.15
Cilynders - 12

AM-38F — made specially for two seater modification of Il-2.

Differences:
- Engine power (takeoff regime), h.p. - 1800
- Ability to work 10 minutes in takeoff regime (at altitude from 0 to 1,5 km)

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Kari, to supercharge translates as nadduv. Forsirovannyj stands for extended performance (tuned up?).

Evgenij, access to data is one thing, but I like the way he uses it. He clearly shows logical steps in development based on operational experience, for example. Concerning supercharging, the point is that most of engines have single staged centrifugal supercharger, and those destined for high altitude operation have either multi-staged mechanical driven superchargers or turbo-compressors. AM-38 should have a single staged centrifugal supercharger and I believe it is placed at the back of the engine.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Jevgeni, the photo clearly shows the supercharger as Franek just pointed. Thanks for the photo anyway! It shows an interesting feature, double overhead camshafts. Thus the Mikulin is the only WW Two aircraft engine in widespread service to have this feature.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

there are two correct designations of the Il-2
Il-2 and Il-2KR (KR stands for corrective reconnaissance AKA artillery spotter)
any reference to "Il-2M","Il-2M2","Il-2M3" or "Il-2 type 3" is completely
INcorrect , so please stop using them.

as for color profiles I don't mind them as long as they are done correctly.
there have been so many incorrect profiles done over the years that were done without source photos or just copied from other works.

I'm not really an engine specialist so I will not argue on that point, but having additional power is good for an aircraft like this so it can carry more armaments and ordnance.
such as the change from RS-82 to RS-132 and so on...

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

kurlannaiskos:

we actually dont use "Il-2M","Il-2M2","Il-2M3" or "Il-2 type 3" designations :)

As I told above, this mistake came long ago, from polish monography about Il-2, and, I beleive, came there from some older book... May be "Il-2 in action"...

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

I got the impression from the post made by "Griffon" that at least one person was using those designations.
my comment was also for 'general purpose' use for anyone out there that was still using those incorrect designations.(irregardless of the source)

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

well, I am NO expert in Soviet WW2 aviation, at least I do not know as much about it as I know about LW aircraft.
I mainly got interested in all the Russian "stuff" when I started "flying" the IL-2 simulation some years ago, which stars the Sturmovik of course.
as this sim has been developed by a russian team, led by Oleg Maddox, who always claimed to have access to some supersecret Russian archives to do the necessary research on performance figures and other stuff, associated with flight sim development, I usually accepted many of the figures, depicted in this sim.
the IL-2, as is featured in this sim, bears many designations, following its development history, from the early single seaters, via makeshift reargunner conversions and field mods up to the latest IL-2M3s.
as such designations like M3 subtypes have crept up in many other books, I took that those were subtype designations and was amazed that the new Osprey did not feature them in the profiles.

by the way, I bought the volume in question about an hour ago after having the chance to read a little bit more through it, and I stand corrected and have to apologize for my first rather negative review.
I now recommend this volume as a great introduction to the Sturmovik and the attack aviation units of the VVS.
it seems that only browsing through books shortly can lead to wrong assumptions at first sometimes....

best regards
phil

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

The erroneous "Il-2 M" designation comes from the log books of German pilots who would record victories over two-seat Il-2s as "Il-2 mit heckschütze" (Il-2 with rear gunner). At least, that's what Bergstrom writes in Black Cross, Red Star Vol. 3.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Ridiculous claim, as several of the author. Soviet wartime designation system remained unknown for general audience for long years of Cold War, hence several unofficial designations appeared. Those originated among publicists, who somehow had to differentiate various versions.

Re: Il-2 Guards Units/Rastrenin (Osprey)
 

Kari Lumppio, purge your inbox asap as it is full. Regarding Mark Solonin, contact me at paso.leatiPÖÖpp.inet.fi