The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hello everyone,

i'm new here. My name is Volker, i'm from germany, and a user of this board, Marc-André Haldimann, recommended to post some of my grandfathers's photos here. Maybe some of the experts here can say something about date and place these photos were taken, or maybe everybody just enjoys to see them. One thing in advance: My grandfather was everything but a blessed photographer, and sixty years of lying around did not improve the quality either.

Some facts about my grandfather:

His name was Heinrich Wunsch, he was born in 1911, and he worked for the Zeppelin Company in Friedrichshafen. Later he started working for Dornier, also in Friedrichshafen. He was, according to my grandmother, airplane mechanic throughout the war. He never talked about this time, so little fact is known to me. He was in France, the Netherlands, and Russia. He died in 1984.
When my grandmother died in 2005, i found a metal box under her bed containing lots of undeveloped negatives. These are the photos shown here.

1) One ofthe places he has been, i think in France. Does somebody know the town ?

http://666kb.com/i/azxxsby47wvrcatqb.jpg

2) A JU-52, pretty well hidden:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3001/...8cfc0c4060.jpg

Better version of this image here:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3001/...fc0c4060_b.jpg

3) Here we have a well hidden DO-17:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2152/...ed2257c4_b.jpg

I'll continue in part 2.

The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather part 2
 

4)A damaged plane, probably a DO-17:

http://666kb.com/i/azxyj8khuj9o71ypv.jpg

5) FW-200 "Condor" on the airfield:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2158/...dbf665223c.jpg

Better version here:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2158/...12a2922e_o.jpg

6) I think this is a DO-217:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2139/...eb01418e1b.jpg

Better version here:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2139/...9b2ae144_o.jpg

I'll continue with part 3 soon.

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Superb set of images Volker, thanks for sharing them with us! :)

Cheers

Peter D Evans
LEMB Administrator

The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather part 3
 

Thank you, Peter.

Here's part 3:

7) The Dornier-team:

http://666kb.com/i/azxy737znqgbpms5f.jpg

8) A DO-17 or DO-217, my grandfather peeking out of the cabin:

http://666kb.com/i/azxzk28w7ngsfpssj.jpg

9) A crash-landed DO-17 with pretty many hits, probably on the coast in northern France:

http://666kb.com/i/azxzpowrlyfzqvair.jpg

I'll continue in the next days.

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Thank you for the pictures. 4 and 8 are Do 217K, possibly the same one.

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Very nice pictures, Volker. Thanks for sharing these with us.

Kind regards,
Rudi.

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Excellent Dornier photographs Volker! Many thanks for sharing them with us, it is very much appreciated.

Regards

Melvin

www.aircrewremembrancesociety.com

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hi, Volker... :)

Welcome on board... your photos are excellent, and very clear despite their age, and being stored under you granmother's bed... !

Photo 2 is very intriguing, especially as I can't quite make out the unit badge on the Ju52.

Photo 3 is a Dornier Do17M (bomber) or P (reconnaissance) aircraft.

Photo 4 is a very sorry-looking Dornier Do217K.

Photo 5 I think is a Focke-Wulf Fw200C.

Photo 6 is a Dornier Do217E of KG40, perhaps based at Bordeaux/Merignac. The 'F8' code can be seen on the fuselage, and there seems to be two small white letters on the fin, perhaps 'IP' or 'AP'. Either way, if this was the rest of the code, it would make it a machine from 6.Staffel/KG40.

Photos 7 & 8 are both Dornier Do217s, 'E' and 'K' respectively.

Photo 9 is a Dornier Do17Z coded U5+FS, from 8.Staffel/KG2, quite possibly on the Channel coast during 1940.

Thank you very much for putting these on the forum. I hope if you have any more, you might like to share these as well. In the meantime, I hope you'll find the forum an interesting and informative place, not to mention friendly as well.
Hals und Beinbruch... :piliot:

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Morning Volker, fabulous pictures i must say, please post more if you can?

Does anybody have the loss details for photo 9. identified by obdl3945,
U5+FS 8/KG2 1940.

Best regs,
Steve.

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Cracking images, for sure!

Could the U5 + FS be WNr 2549 on 15 September 1940? This is only speculation, although the apparent location, damage and code letters could be made to "fit", the fates of the crew of 2549 on the other hand (I killed, 3 missing) might be harder to rationalise with this photo.

I am sure Peter Cornwell or Chris Goss might have a view or some ideas?

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Thank you all for your help and comments. Of course there are some more pictures.

10) A totally damaged Bomber (DO ?), probably on the coast in northern France or in the Netherlands, my grandfather is standing on the wreck:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3245/...1ee3c8c1_b.jpg

11) Another view of the wrecked plane. It looks like a biplane to me. Does someone have an idea what it could be ?

http://666kb.com/i/azyvd947b0fmj39wh.jpg

12) This looks like a test run to me, the plane could be the same as in 7):

http://666kb.com/i/azyv7prgznvekcr1d.jpg

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hello Volker!
Quite wonderful pictures! I do have tried to identify the flying boat, but got no joy...
Here´s a link to the Dorniers flying boats
http://www.msacomputer.com/FlyingBoa...n-Dornier.html
Could it have been a foreign flying boat captured by the Luftwaffe; or a civilian model also used for VIP or General purpose flights?
Did your father fly on operations? I remember a technician from Siemens and Telefunken that came to Brazil after the war. He told me he was with Hptm Lent when the first FuG 212 were installed. He also mentioned a flight he did with the Me 410 on night-fighter duties being a technician! On that mission they shot down a 4-engined bomber from the RAF. He died some years ago, but I enjoyed talk with him.
It is good to see that you do have interest on the achievements of your family. You came to the correct place. There are a lot of wonderful people here as well as a dozen of very Expert Writters and Historians ( with huges W and H ).
Wish you all the best
From Brazil
Adriano Baumgartner ( with Luftwaffe´s Baumgartners relatives on WW2 too! )

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

PS: If this is really a Dornier, this is probably a Do-24!

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

No.10 & 11 don't look like a Dornier design at all.

Bi-plane, pre-war, very obsolete. Doesn't even look dutch to me, could it be some french design?

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hi...

I don't think the Do217E (photo 12) is the same machine as either 6 or 7... different degree of staffel colouring on the spinner.

As for the wreck... in its shown condition, I haven't a clue... LOL !

I'm very inclined towards Ruy's suggestion that it may be something French, as many of their inter-war designs were very 'chunky', shall I say, and this looks to be in that category. I'd definitely say a biplane, though. First glance, I have to admit, I thought it may be similar in layout to a Handley Page Hereford (hope that's right), the pre-war RAF biplane bomber, with twin engines and its lower wing slightly separate from the fuselage... Matchbox made a fine model of it in 1/72 scale a good few years ago.

Regards...

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hi,
for the wreck, I suggest a french LéO H-257 (or in this serie) from the french navy.
It is upside down.

Von Alles

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Gentlemen, along with Von Alles, my contender for the mysterious wrecked seaplane... :)

Loire et Olivier LeO H-258. I also believe in the photo, the wings have flopped forwards, so much so, that they are actually upside down. Note the rear engine nacelle on the thumbnails, very angular and squared off, just like the remnants of the engine nacelles on the wreck... and credit where due, Von Alles just pipped me to posting the answer... well done... !

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hello Adriano,

after the mysterious plane seems to be identified, i'd like to tell you that i know very few about what my grandfather did in wartime. There is only one person still alive who could tell me, but she lives far away. I have some photos here that were shot out of a flying plane, but i do not think he went on missions. I think he inspected and repaired crashed or shot-down airplanes for his employer, Dornier. There are no photos showing him in uniform, but sometimes he's pictured with soldiers. I don't think he was a member of the army in the early days of war. For the later days of war i'm missing information; photos of the post-war time are existing.

Greetings to Brazil

Volker

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Here's the last set of pictures for today:

13) Shot-down bomber, it seems to be the same as in 9) :

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3288/...330a36618e.jpg

Larger version:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3288/...62bfa654_o.jpg

14) Crash-landing of a DO-217:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3093/...23fa953ae3.jpg

Larger version:
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3093/...2fbeceeb_o.jpg

15) Another hard landing for a DO-217:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2133/...9d32b8cc2d.jpg

Larger version:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2133/...32b8cc2d_b.jpg

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Dear Volker,

Thanks so much for sharing your fantastic picture collection. You see from all the reactions you get that the whole TOCH community is gearing up to shed more light on those unique documents of your grand father.

As I'm not a Dornier specialist, I won't be of much help, but I immensly enjoy discovering your collection, as the Dornier 217 subtype is not that well documented and as this bird always caught my interest, especialy the Do 217 K.

As Adriano, I tried to identify the totally wrecked and half sunken machine on which your grand-father strolls. The only sure thing I can suggest is to rule out all Dornier productions, in favour of a Fench design, though not a Latécoère. Am keeping up the research on this matter. And just noticed the identification is done! I hadn't checked back since two hours LOL...

Again, thanks for your generosity, and hoping that fresh knowledge will further enhance your family records.

Sincerely

Marc

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hi, Volker...

I like the comment on your previous posting... "this is the last for today". I can only hope that means there's more to come on future occasions. I especially like Photo 13 of the Dornier Do17Z... :).

I can only agree with other peoples' comment about these photos. Their clarity, even some sixty-eight years on, make them really wonderful. It is great that you have shared them on this forum. Thank you again for this kindness.

Best wishes...

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Thanks for sharing these photos

Is there a possibility that Do17 U5+FS was one of the four 8/KG2 aircraft that returned on 13-8-40 with combat damage and wounded crew,

Brian Bines

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

I fear Brian that regarding the handvoll of possibilities we hv some difficulties to find the right plane, My choice was also turned toward that date, hv you noted the well distibuted "hammering" that's pilots where artists

Remi

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hi Volker,

Welcome and
thanks so much for sharing this pic's with us.


Rolf

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

The next photos are of the few i don't have negatives of, so these are scanned photos. The quality suffered over the last sixty years.

16) Aerial view onto a channel:

http://666kb.com/i/azzwv0c9kxd2a6j6j.jpg

17) Another team photo, maybe these are the crew members of the bomber in the background:

http://666kb.com/i/azzwxayoxri5xycgr.jpg

18) Picture of a DO-17 or DO-217 in flight:

http://666kb.com/i/azzwz37n2eqyqfhjv.jpg

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Excellent images http://www.letletlet-warplanes.com/f.../icon_clap.gif http://www.letletlet-warplanes.com/f.../icon_clap.gif

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Hello,
I suggest more a LéO H-257bis (radial engines) than a H-258 (with in line engines). These two types were in line service in 1939-40, the last H-257 was built in march 1939 !!
Very intresting serie, thank you for sharing.
Von Alles

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Picture 8 - Do217 with Grandfather peeking from the window - can anyone make out the werk nummer it looks like 4423. If so from Ulf Balkes book the crew baled out of this aircraft on 24/25-6-1944 north of Rouen.

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

This unknown badge is very interesting indeed.

It's a Do 17P (with BMW 132 engines).

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

For those who are trying to find out more about the badge on the JU-52, here is the biggest available version of it:

http://666kb.com/i/b00wqtmg36huu55x1.jpg

And here are some more photos:

19) Mechanics at work:

http://666kb.com/i/b00ws942s7oa7imut.jpg

20) View on the airfield out of a plane:

http://666kb.com/i/b00wuexlp1chh599x.jpg

21) Loading bombs:

http://666kb.com/i/b00wvvtdrfxh522ph.jpg

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

Thanks very much for posting those photos, Volker. Dornier twins are always been one of my favorites.

Juha

Re: The "Dornier" pictures of my grandfather
 

22) Same Bomber as in 21:

http://666kb.com/i/b01y7a7o3awozc0rl.jpg

23) Bomber on the airfield:

http://666kb.com/i/b01y8z5bt7veaaj8h.jpg

24) Crash-landed or just sunken in bomber. It seems to be the same as in 15:

http://666kb.com/i/b01yd0r412tuqn9i9.jpg