Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

There will be edited a new book in Poland concerning Soviet-Polish air war in 1939. It should be released in August or September 2008. Just now I have done some author’s and editorial’s corrections. The end of editorial works is seen, :-)

The title: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in September, October 1939.

The book has about 200 pages (size A-5), about 51.400 words. There are 16 color drawings of Soviet and Polish planes, plus about 60 black and white photos. Some used photos are known but other are not.

For many English readers it is not good information - the whole book is done only in Polish. There are no any English text, summary etc. I do not suppose, that this material could be done in English in the future (it is quite small market for such “strange” stories). Maybe I am wrong?

This is the first book focused about this quite less know small air war on the beginning of WW II. The Soviet during invasion on Poland (17 IX 1939) had also used quite large air forces (about 3.300 combat, land military planes). During this very short war there were used in fact less aviation forces - about 1.000 combat planes. There were in fact not so many air combats between Soviet invasion air forces and Polish Lotnictwo Wojskowe.

During this air war Soviet had used additional (beside to VVS RKKA) aviation forces like: a few NKVD air units, plus tens of civil planes taken from GVF - Aeroflot. The last, large, air force, which was also used against Poland was maritime aviation (Baltic and Black See aviation units).
The Soviet planes had done the last combat flights about 7 October 1939. Soviet air units had done the last flights later, then Luftwaffe against Poles.

This is the third material, which I have written about this particular topic. First was printed in 2003, next in 2005, and just now it will be a book.
The whole material has been written with the support of many sources: Soviet archive document, Polish documents, many book printed in Russian, Poland and other countries and last but not least – support of friends.

Other my texts about this “small Russian-Poles air war”:

2005: Ratas over Eastern Part of Poland. I-16 During Soviet Aggression on Poland. „Szczury” nad Kresami. Myśliwce I-16 podczas sowieckiej agresji na Polskę IX-X 1939 r., p. 7, 18 b&w photos, [in:] Militaria XX wieku 5 (8)/2005.
2003: Soviet Aviation in War over Poland, September 1939, Vol. 2. Lotnictwo sowieckie w wojnie nad Polską wrzesień 1939 roku, cz.1; p. 6, 7 b&w photos, [in:] Militaria i Fakty 5-6/2003.
2003: Soviet Aviation in War over Poland, September 1939, Vol. I. Lotnictwo sowieckie w wojnie nad Polską wrzesień 1939 r., cz. 1; p. 5, 7 b&w photos, [in:] Militaria i Fakty 4/2003.

Regards,
Mirek Wawrzyński

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Hi,

do we already have a release date?

Regards

Robert

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Hi
Nice information. My book is just edited in Poland. Since 5 IX 2008 it is possible to buy it in Warsaw/Poland, :-)

Editor: Agencja Wydawnicza CB
Title: Czerwone gwiazdy sojusznik czarnych krzyży nad Polską. Lotnictwo sowieckie nad Kresami wrzesień – październik 1939 r.
Author: Mirosław Wawrzyński
Sizet: A-5
Pages: 219 (185 str. tekstu plus 32 str. kredy)
Photos b&w: 46 i 1 mapa
Colors: 8 pages: I-16 typ 5 i 10, I-15bis, SB, DB-3, R-5, R-Zet, U-2/Po-2, PWS-26, RWD-8, PZL P.7a, P.11a i P.11c, PZL.23, PZL.37.


You may see more but only in Polish

http://www.dws.org.pl/viewtopic.php?f=96&t=121689

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Where can I get a copy from a place that will ship to America?

Jason

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Good question?
Send me off the board mail, I will think with your case.

mirwaw_xl@wp.pl

Regards,
mw

PS.
You are aware the book is whole in Polish, no any English part, no translation etc.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Better late then never, :-)

Last days, some pages taken from my book are hanged on Jacek Jackiewcz web side:

http://www.kecay.info/

There are some pages of text, and a few photos, color drawings. You may see them:

http://www.kecay.com/mirek.htm

Regards,

Mirek Wawrzyński

Re: The last air flight over Poland IX-X 1939
 

Hi
There is quite long article in Polish aviation magazine Aero about the last air flight fighting over Poland in SO/SGO "Polesie" (25 IX - 5 X 1939); 1 PWs-26 and 2 X RWD-8 (46 flights in this period). The title is "Ostatnie biało-czerwone szachownice". This is very extended material, which was first edited in my book "Red Stars over Poland".

The article has 16 b&w phots, pp. 4-13, [in:] Aero nr 1(20)/2009.

The 1st/cover page:

http://kagero.pl/index.php?option=com_c ... &Itemid=29

M. Wawrzyński

Re: The last air flight over Poland IX-X 1939
 

What fighting? Those planes were not combat planes. Just training and observation assets.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

They were flying combat missions and were targets for enemy fire. Does it not qualify for fighting?

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

What combat missions or fighting?

RWD-8 was unarmed sport plane reaching 175 km/h, PWS-26 was a biplane with top speed 217 km/h carrying one MG and two 12,5 kg bombs - essentially World War I design. Those planes could not carry out any combat missions in 1939 aside of communication and recon duties. Every their combat use would be kamikaze-style operation. I am surprised their pilots flown them at all supposedly praying not to meet any German combat aircraft!

Yet possibly Polish forces had only such "combat planes" in late September...

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Nobody denies that both RWD-8 and PWS-26 were primary trainers, something like Tiger Moth and Avro Tutor, respectively. To claim that those 1930s aircraft were essentially WWI designs sounds ridiculous to say the least, however.
Nonetheless you have not answered a very simple question - should be sorties like liaison, reconnaissance and attacking ground targets, all under enemy fire, considered combat missions, and if not, why?

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Certainly attacking ground targets under enemy fire is a combat action. However combat action carried out by non-combat planes is very odd especially they possessed flight characteristic fairly close to World War I planes.

It is not ridiculous that someone sent those pilots for death like kamikaze...

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

If you are in an aircraft that is, or is likely to be, under attack by enemy aircraft or ground fire whilst fulfilling an authorised duty you are undertaking a combat mission (IMHO).

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Well, if everyone agrees those were combat missions, then how about those flown by unarmed Cubs and Austers? And were the latter like WWI planes?
This was as much the same kind of sorties. The fact is that they were much more dangerous, but those men, finding those aircraft, volunteered for them. That is the nature of war, that it requires risk and sacrifice.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

If you discuss unarmed Cubs and Austers you might as well look at the definition of combat rules by the forces operating them, instead of simply making up our own rules. Most combattants had elaborate systems defining what a constituted combat mission (or its equivalent with or without encountering any enemy forces).

However once you fire at or throw bombs at the enemy the point is mute, regardless if you are flying the most modern or obsolete aircraft in the sky.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Oh, British rules constituted combat sortie in quite a straightforward way, and those were later reapplied for Polish AF.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Sorry Ruy, can't agree with you here. Don't forget that an unarmed machine can correct artillery fall of shot, or radio observations during reconnaissance that brings in strike aircraft. The pilot of an unarmed, unescorted light plane is at considerable risk. I doubt he would consider that a moot point.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Some word of explanation is needed here!

Now I fully understand why Poles had to flight combat missions with unarmed or WWI-style planes. That is obvious taken into account their air forces and air defense system were destroyed by Luftwaffe in a first week of fighting. After 7th September Poles were able to shoot down only about 1,5 German combat plane daily on average! :D

So I do not understand what is this book about??? There were practically no Polish air units capable to fight Soviet air forces in 17th September because deplorable remnants of Polish military aviation escaped to Romania that day! :confused:

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

If your point is trolling, then look for another forum. Luftwaffe turned up unable to defeat much weaker Polish air force. The latter, awaited supplies of modern aircraft, that had to arrive via Rumanian ports. Polish airmen were send there to take them over, but the situation prevented it.
The book is about Soviet Air Forces operations over Poland in 1939. Soviet Union was at the time Germany's ally. I think it is obvious from the title of the thread.

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

I think main purpose of your presence here is trolling and twaddling about Polish air forces complete defeat in September 1939. Here you are real German archive data about Luftwaffe losses and victories during all campaign:

- German bombers battle losses before 8th September - 76% of overall losses
- German bombers air victories before 8th September - 73% overall victories
- German fighters battle losses before 8th September- 60% of overall losses
- German fighters air victories before 8th September - 70% overall victories

[Source: Compiled from M. Emmerling "Luftwaffe nad Polską" vol.1 pp. 197-203, vol. 2 pp. 303-308]

As one can see Polish resistance in the air ceased to exist after one week of fighting. Polish aviation lost 75% of its strength being able to destroy only 6% of Luftwaffe planes. Luftwaffe bombers could not find viable targets after 5th September so many bomber squadrons had a free time. It is not surprising because antique Polish fighters could not catch-up German bombers and Polish air defense had only about 50 modern large caliber anti-aircraft guns. Deplorable remnants of Polish military planes had to escape to Romania in 17th September simply because they lost ground support, ammo and PO&L stocks. No Romanian agreement to help transit war materials to Poland was possible at that time due to heavy German diplomatic pressure. In fact Romanian authorities took German side then. Soviet aviation met no real aerial resistance during Red Army intervention aside of several air incidents.

That is full sad truth about poor Polish Aviation crushed by Luftwaffe in a week. Luftwaffe did not need any "Red Stars" ally to successfully accomplish its job! :D

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Is this why they had to level Warsaw? Having nothing else to do in their free time than target-practicing on civilian population?

Re: Red Stars – Black Cross’s Ally over Poland. Soviet Aviation over East Part of Poland in IX, X 1939, a New Book
 

Yes, LW had easily finished Polish Lotnictwo Wojskowe without any VVS RKKA support, it is true and obvious for over >60 years, but as I see till now not for you? Wow!

Where are you come from? From Mars? I think so.

LW did the same next in 1940 with other air forces finishing them very fast too over: Denmark, Norway, Holland, Belgium, and France but not over GB, in 1941 you can add Yugoslavian and Greece. This is so obvious, that I can not understand your claims to this topic?

Probably you are not educated in general political history or you have big gap in your maid about this part of history?

Hitler had needed only Stalin agreement and pact to begin WW II.

Stalin had used this situation and get as much as possible from Hitler in 1939-41: ½ Poland, all Baltic countries, some Finland + Romania in 1940 too. This was the main reason of Soviet “help” in Hitler’s war.
Soviet used then also own aviation over: Poland and Baltic countries, over Finland, and Romania too. It was normal modern war. Probably you are not aware this? I think so!

Better for you to read some political history books before you had begun such empty and directly trolling talking.

PS.
PWS-26 was twice attacked by I-16s, also was fired by Germans ground troops too.
On 1 X 39 the landing place was bombed by Soviet light bombers, which had damaged 2x RWD-8 – not flyable later.

Of course for you it would be not any case to talking about any kind of air war or even combat mission. Very Funny attitude but it is very stupid one as for me.

Regards,
mw