TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Hi everybody, i'm a new guy here but an old time luftwaffe fan. Here's my question. I've been told the JG 301 was the only combat unit to receive the TA-152 H. I've also been told the III/ JG 301 was supposed to receive these birds but they went to the stab/ JG 301.
So did the other gruppen receive these planes ?
would the planes from the stab wear green numbers?
if such is the case, were they any "yellow #" and wich group did they belong to ?
I assume the old rule was still used ... 1-4-7 : white;2-5-8 : red (or blue) ; 3-6-9 : yellow ... etc
lots of questions uh ?

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Hi,

III./JG301 did receive 152Hs. It received its first Hs (11) on Jan 27 1945 which they picked up at Cottbus. They flew their first mission on March 2 with no enemy contact, though they had to fend of attacks by 109s. When it was seen that III./JG301 was not going to reach its authorized strength of 35 a/c they were ordered to had over their a/c to Stab 301 and re-equiped with 190A-9s (March 13).

The Stab a/c had green numbers.

info from Harmann's Ta 152 book.

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

well ... can you tell me which group actually flew them ?
only III ?
then wich staffel ?
here's a pic ... would you say it's "yellow one" or "green one" ?

ta 152 h

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Why do you ask which, III or Stab, actaully flew the H, as I thought it was clear that both did.

WNr 150007, 'black' 3 was flown by Reschke while with III./JG301. From text in the book: staffel 9 > white, 10 > red, 11 > yellow, 12 > black.

It is a 'green' number. It is a cropped pic of a line up of Stab/JG301 a/c.

There was also Jagdstaffel 152 (formerly EK152) part of Gefechsverband K.d.E and Stab JG11(4 to 6) that had 152Hs. Stab JG11 flew no combat but did loose 2 Hs on a transfer flight to Leck when engaged by Spitfires. Another crashed when landing.

Buy the Hermann book. ISBN 0-7643-0860-2

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Compare the number to the lighter color in the RV band, what do you think?

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

"the story goes as follow : I built the trimaster TA 152 H a few years ago and recently met a guy who built it too ... it so happens we both built the "green one".
as we were discussing I showed this pic (i cropped it myself) and claimed it was the green one ... he said no it's a "yellow one" ... I then asked "has anyone jeard of a yellow one ?" thus leading me tto some researches on tthe net ...
quite simple isn't it ?
sounds like you agree with me about this plane, am I wrong ?

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

I think the "one" doesn't match the yellow band ... looks as if it were a green one but my eyes are not as they used to be ... lol

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

For what its worth, I can give some of the content of a letter from Ob.d.L. General der Jagdflieger dated Berlin-Kladow 20.03.1945 concerning the future conversions for all Jagdgruppen (Rüststandentwicklung in den Verbänden).
In this document, the only units to receive the Ta 152 was the J.G.301.
I./J.G.301 was to convert from FW 190A-9/R-11 via FW 190D-9/R-11 to Ta 152.
The same was the case for II./J.G.301. The III./J.G.301 had already converted fully to the Ta 152 and was to remain with this type. At this stage the IV./J.G.301 had been disbanded.
The J.G.11 was to convert as follows:
I./J.G.11 from FW 190A-8 and A-9 to Fw 190D-9.
II./J.G.11 from Bf 109G-10 to Bf 109K-4
III./J.G.11 from FW 190A-8 and A-9 to FW 190D-9.

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

JG 11 indeed had several Ta 152s in last weeks of war. But is was due to "procurement" skills of JG 11 personell. It was not because of official instruction to equip the unit with this rare bird.

See Prien/Rodeike´s JG1/JG11 book (third part) for details

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Situation as of 11. of april 1945! Se attached document.

Junker

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Dear Junker,

Could you give the source of this document?

Jaap

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Chefgruppe Gen.Qu: Einsatzbereitschaften der flg. Verbände im Bereich Lfl.Kdo. Reich Stand: 12.4.1945, abends.

Is to be found in BA/MA Freiburg. I do not have the exact reference at hand.

Junker

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Could you please explain collumns in that table?

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

March 1945 (emergency fighter program)

I./JG 301 Ta 152
II./JG 301 Ta 152
III./JG 301 Ta 152 H

I & II were converting from Fw 190 A-9/R11 to Fw 190 D-9/R11 to Ta 152 while III was set to have the Ta 152 H.

I am not sure if I & II were to get the C model or H...

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

another question about these planes : do we now have a fair idea about the camo scheme of these planes ? I've seen it changing over the years from my first 1/72 model and its 74/75/76 scheme to guys actually saying that the upper surfaces were RLM 81/82 ...
when I built my trimaster model ten years ago they'd claim a mix of 81/82 on the fuselage and 75/82 on the wings ...

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Actually, the document supplied by ju55dk says that the Stab Staffel of JG 301 and III.JG 301 are to be equipped with the Ta 152. I do not see II Gruppe as referenced.



Interestingly, a fuel requirements document from 19 March lists Stab, I, II, and III Gruppen of JG 301 as being equipped with the 190 A-9/R11 and IV Gruppe equipped with the 109G-10/R6.

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Proofs of operational Tank 152 H of Stab./JG 301 wanted ? For the fun here two extracts from Ofw Jupp Keil's logbook:
- flight Nr.160 Ta 152 green 3 combat mission start Stendal on 10 April 1945 19.13 landing Sachau 20.45 duration 92 min "N. Braunschweig Luftkampf mit 15 Thunderbolt. 1 w. Abschuß".
- Flight Nr.163 Ta 152 green 1 combat mission start Hagenow on 17 april 1945 07.35 landing Stendal 08.45 duration 70 min "Tiefangriff Stendal".

Real documents are anyway better than dreams or speculation.

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Thank you, Jean-Yves, for those two flight book extracts. You are right, "Real documents are anyway better than dreams or speculation." So, thank you again for sharing that information with us.

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

According to "Jagdgeschwader 301/302 "Wilde Sau" In defense of the Reich with the Bf109, Fw190 and Ta152" By Willi Reschke there was a unit called "Erprobungskommando Ta152" led by Hauptman Stolle who flew Ta152H´s. Was this unit actually Stab JG11? I see that Hptm Bruno Stolle was the Gruppenkommandeure of I/JG11in this between 10.44 - 25.11.44, according to www.ww2.dk/air/jagd/jg11.htm. I guess however that the interesting part is where Hptm stolle served post -44 though...

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Hej Jørn,
I didn't read this closely before, WIH is the type of aircraft assigned to 1/JG 400, it reads like He 226/229 or Me 226/229 ? !!
bregds
SES

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

It reads Ho 226/229, also known as Horten Ho VII(8-226) and Ho IX(8-229)!


Junker

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

YGABSM, that means that the project must have been far enough advanced for the type to be about to go into production ????????????? otherwise it would not apear on a plan for refit of a unit.

This is what I found in a quich search:
By the time the factory was occupied by American troops in late April 1945 and all development stopped, the first 20 pre-production aircraft were in a advanced state of construction with various subassemblies being found in the factory, as well as the V-6 a two seater trainer.

http://tanks45.tripod.com/Jets45/His...oIX/Go-229.htm


bregds
SES

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

This discussion continued on another forum, which might be of interest:
http://www.luftwaffe-experten.org/fo...st=0&#entry905

bregds
SES

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

NOTE: that the full document, from Ju55k, is already published since many years by Michael Holm, see there:

http://www.ww2.dk/articles/elflr1.html

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

He has published the contents, not the original document!!

Junker

Re: TA-152 in JG 301 ?
 

Sure Ju55dk, we all prefer original documents when possible and i want to thanks you for that.

The link posted above is just to give some help and to better understand from what kind of document it is extracted.