Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Hi guys,

I would like to find out whether the Messerschmitt Bf-109 E1 from Oberleutnant Hubertus von Holtey (5./JG 26) crashed in the water of the IJsselmeer or on the ground of the area around Weesp (de Klomp). Can anybody tell me something about this crash in the first days of the German invasion in the Netherlands?

And does anybody know what happened to Hubertus von Holtey in the later years of the war and his life? So far I could only trace him back to 1941...

Thanks!

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

I don't have any dates in db, but it seems he went on to command the Erg./JG 26 for a time.

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Thanks for the reply, Jim.
Correct, I also read that he became the commander of 5./JG 26 in 1940-1941. He even flew with Galland's Me-109 E! :) But for some reason I can't find anything that happened after May 1941. Maybe he was involved in a plane crash? I could not find him on the list of MIA from JG 26 and the Volksbund website... I Googled his name many times, but this is what I know.
And I'm also trying to find out what happened to his Messerschmitt Bf-109 E-1. Maybe the wreck was never recovered, and it would be really interesting to know if the plane ditched in the water of the lake! ;)

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

According all accounts he came down at De Klomp, just north of Veenendaal, which in turn was a few km in fron t of the Grebbelinie, the main Dutch defence line. By May 11 this area was in principle in the hands of the German troops, so Holtey was recovered by them and not made PoW. (If so he would almost certainly have been brought to the UK and then Canada for the rest of the war). The confusion of the IJsselmeer is that these indications in the German loss records usually refer to the area targeted by the original mission. Holtey and two/three other BF109's were attacking Dutch anti-aircraft positions south of the IJsselmeer.

Pieter

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Vinnie,

I have long sought a photo and further details of this May 11, 1940, a/c loss and incident. There has been a local book in Dutch about this incident, but it doesn't make it clear exactly where it came down. In it, they published a photo of Black 14 from 2./JG21 that was supposed to be the force-landed a/c, but this is obviously in error. When I made a TOCH request some time ago about this, I got no resolution. I still want to locate a photo of this a/c on the ground after it came down, but so far I don't know of one's existence. I've found photos of almost all the other Bf109s that came down in Holland during the Meidagen except that one. If you find one, I'd greatly appreciate a copy. The fact that no photo has surfaced makes me suspicious that perhaps he did land in the IJsselmeer lake. Like you, I would sure like to know the answer to this. Why do you think he came down in the IJsselmeer?

A photo of what was von Holtey's Black 1 at about this time was sold on eBay a couple of years ago. This was not of the crash, however.

In our EOE Luftwaffe loss data base we have this loss reported as:

May 11, 1940: 5./JG26 Messerschmitt Bf109E. Shot down during attack on AA battery south of the Ijsselmeer. FF Oberleutnant Hubertus Fr von Holtey (Staffelkapitän) captured wounded – later released. Aircraft 100% write-off.

This would suggest that the crash was on land, but we really don't know that for sure.

Regards,

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Thanks for the great information, guys!

I started my research with the Luftwaffe losses over Holland, as listed by 'airwar39-45'. This list says that Von Holtey's plane ditched in the south of the IJsselmeer, though other sources also mention that it crashed near De Klomp. This site is located way under the IJsselmeer, so that is quite confusing when trying to locate the possible wreck. Now I read all posts and look at the information I have, I guess that it crashed on the land instead of the cold and dark water of the lake.

Unfortunately I have no picture of the aircraft. If I would find a picture I will contact you, Larry.

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Hi guys

I can stretch his biography a few months. He was the Staffelkapitan of 2./JG26 from 17th May 1941 until 30th June 1941 when he joined the Staff of JG26, with whom on 12th August 1941 he claimed a British Blenheim. His full name was hubertus Alexus von Holtey. He had been awarded the Spanienkreuz for his efforts in Spain!

Regards

Johannes

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Vinnie,

Start with better reading. T505, version 2008, says IJsselmeer(south of).
It will saves you and us a lot of time and confusion.

Jaap Woortman
Study Group Airwar 1939-1945.

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Jaap,

There is no need to put me in negative daylight this way. In the Dutch version 'zuiden van' could mean the southern part of the lake, whilst other sources mention De Klomp (SOUTH OF the lake, which in English translation obviously would indicate a lower position on the map). It would have been more appropriate if the list would mention the exact location, since it is known.
Life is a learning process, and it would be nice if you would accept that instead of making a comment like this.
And yes, you are right. But it seems that I'm not the only one who got confused.

To all the others I can say: thank you for your time and help. I guess that this case is closed, since no more information about H. A. Von Holtey is available.

Regards,

Vinnie

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Hello Lads!
Just to fill in on some info of Hubertus Baron von Holtey. He was a very close childhood friend of my grandfather, Wolfgang Thimmig of NJG 1, NJG 2 and NJG 4, and they grew up doing a lot of hunting together. I know he survived the war and that he and my grandfather were friends their entire lives but not much else.
I have a photo of him I will add!

Best regards

Max

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Wow, that's very nice! Thank you for sharing :)
I would love to see the picture of him!

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Hubertus von Holtey is the man on the right!
Enjoy!

Max

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Max,

Does the photo show v. Holtey during the 1940 time, or sometime before or after the war?

Regards,

Re: Crash of H. von Holtey on 11.5.1940
 

Unfortunately, I don't really know when it is taken, but I suppose it is during the war. Don't know what year though, sorry about that.

Max

von Holtey photograph
 

This photo shows Joachim Müncheberg on a visit to Ergänzungsgruppe JG 26 at Cognac shortly before he left for Sicily in early 1941. Note the ex-9./JG 26 Bf 109 behind the men.

Don