One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Hi guys,

That picture
http://www.ebay.de/itm/Foto-photo-JA...06548788740212

Blue 6? JG 27?

Cheers,
Franck.

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Salut Franck!

That's a great shot!

My guess would be "Blaue 6", I./JG 27. The camouflage scheme points towards an W.Nr. 330.xxx - 331.xxx batch machine. The W.Nr. can be faintly discerned atop of the fin swastika, unfortunately not readable...

Thanks for your pointer!
MA

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Bonjour/Bonsoir Marc,

According to this site http://www.ww2.dk/air/jagd/jg27.htm
4./JG 27 was created 15/8/44 and disbanded 15/2/1945. If the code number is blue, could be. If not 2./JG 27.
But I./JG 27 is OK for me.
I just wonder if camouflage matches with this unit, particularly the painting on spinner?...

A part ça tout baigne mon ami!

Cheers, Franck.

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Good evening Franck!

"Blue 6" or not, that's the million dollar question, my friend... It could be "Braune 6" or "Grüne 6" as well...

As for the camo, it only confirms what the state of the trees in the background do indicate: winter 1944 - 1945; thus definitely built before the Flossenburg und Cham - Bodenwöhr style camouflage became the Spring 1945 trend.

Heureux que tout baigne!
MA

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

;)

What's on wing leading edge, triangular, close to large wheel fairing ??? Hummm?

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

A BSK 16 gun camera? This would be indeed a rare sight on a K-4;-))

Cheers
Marc

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

A BSK 16? I think we must be careful. To my eyes, I see only the curved end to the long leading edge wing slat with a crumpled area abutting the this slat. Besides, this area is in the wrong location for the camera. According to my information, the BSK was located in the wing's leading edge just inboad of the wheel's upper surface bulge. And, for what it's worth, I tend to agree that this aircraft was from the 330xxx series.

Hal

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Hello,

Hal leading edge slat is ending under "red arrow" level
This triangular device is situated against the wheel fairing.
I don't know if it's a BSK 16 but for me it makes sense since it does correspond with the old Bf109E camera location for the access to the camera was made through inside wheel bay ... Only the BF109F had an access from beneath the wing through an hatch.
Anyway, there is something which is not due to crash landing. That "something is regular shaped and riveted on wing.

Tschüss.

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Franck and Harold,

Agreed Franck with your expertise. It is the only picture showing a Bord Schuss Kamera (BSK) on a K-4... An absolute gem indeed.

Cheers
Marc

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Franck and Marc,
I can see you gentlemen have sharper eyes than me. My photographic reference is found on page 140 from Classic's "Recognition Manual" and so it would appear the location was changed slightly with this K-4. Good detective work!

Hal

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Looking at the shape of it when magnifying it, it is not consistent with a known camera installation as well as lacking an opening in the front, can we then exclude it from being a clot of dried mud or cow dung stuck to the leading edge of the wing when this bird sat down in what looks like farm land? I can't find that the shape of the 'object' is designed to house a camera. Note: (No pun intended)

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Hi,

Don't worry Goran, you're welcome :).

A bit of mud? Yes on leading edge under the "triangular device", could be, and I admit that makes sense because of the nature of ground.
But If mud then it glues, then it's wet ... Other part with gluing mud? Don't know.

I'll be glad to see an extract of the documentation you're talking about Hal. This I don't have. It will be helpful, just scan and give the references to avoid "fights" with author and so on, you know.
If it's not a BSK 16 Schusskamera, other possible camera? Mean earlier model.
The only reference I have are drawings extract from three views and just profile drawings of K-6, K-8, K-10. Not a lot to check location.

Just one thing I'm sure: that triangular device is real, it does follow the wing upper surface, that curve is a perfect intersection between a half cone and wing surface curviline and stop exactly at its apex, it's riveted on it and doesn't show a bended aspect due to crash landing; it's genuine.

By the contrary:
Suppose it's part of wing surface skin and/or fairing skin which has been lifted during crash:
Doesn't explain that riveted link and doesn't match with structural line known in that area. Hence my first proposal.

It's a pity that area just beneath that isn't clear... If there is mud, here it is. But an aperture which has been damaged by crash, it seems too. Hummm don't go that far ...

Cheers, Franck.

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Gentlemen,
If you have photos of the Avia C-199, on exhibit at the Vojenske Museum in Prague, you will see the same BSK 16 features as in the Bf 109K. They are the same. Note the lens arperture is not circular (as for the Bf 109G) but is instead shaped like a shoe heel with the straight edge at the top. Just above, and slightly aft, of the lens arperture is a strange one-piece stamping of a equalterial triangular pyramid with smooth edges. It is this stange feature we see in the K-4 photo. Mystery solved.

Hal

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Hello,

Strange ... Didn't send an answer this morning???
Making short...
See Avia picture in Falcon site...
Hence that K-4 picture shows us a BSK 16 without doubts. But it's not where we expected.
In fact I was wrong in my former analisis saying that it was like former Bf109E position. The avia picture shows precisely the BSK 16 in same position that Bf109E, G-6/AS and G-14/AS position. I don't know for other G types.

Resume:
We have a k-4 with a BSK 16 not in expected position, yes, but we have.

Marc is the happiest man in the world now :D

Cheers. Franck.

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

256 Euros today. Two days left: 1000 at the end?

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Thanks for all your inputs, guys..

And yes, Franck, I'm the happiest Bf 109 nut on the world;-))

Cheers
Marc

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Our BSK-16 equipped Bf 109 K-4 picture fetched a staggering 943 Euros....

The pic shows most of its W.Nr. painted on the top of its tail in the usual Mtt manner. It starts with 332 xxx. I would be very grateful to know its full W.Nr. which must be legible on the original.

Thanks in advance
Marc

Re: One Bf109K-4 on eBay
 

Another bf 109 pic for the (crazy)sudek13...... Collection...!!!