Bf109 after the war
 

Greetings all,

when we mention Bf109 we in general think about its service during the WW2 (of course, also before the war). But how much it is used after the war and which countries use it? I am wonder does it seen any use in two Germany after the war?

Cheers :)

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Hello, Srecko,

after the armistice all of the Bf 109s in both parts of Germany disappeared in the aluminium and steel furnaces.

Bf 109s produced in wartime were used by:

- Switzerland
- Finland
- Bulgaria
- Rumania
- Yugoslavia (acquired from Bulgaria afaik)
- Spain

Post-war production was done by:

- Czechoslovakia
- Spain

Regards

Roland

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Thank you Roland :) Info about scrap into raw material is interesting for me.

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

I believe the new Israeli Air Force used some 109's produced in post-war Czechoslovakia, although these did not have DB engines.

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

@ Brian and all,

Czechoslovakian Me 109 in after-war production were called "Avia S-199", equipped with Jumo 211. Some of these a/c saw service in the Israelian Air Force - along with Spitfires as well.

Best Regards
Norbert

P.S.: Edited an added for to have a glance at for instance
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Avia_S-199

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Avia is much differ from original design but as I know they do have some of the originals there in service (???)

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Pilot, I am not sure some the above answers really address your question.

Czechoslovakia used the G-14 and G-10 in the post war period briefly. Some of these were in 1945 when the "independence" movement started before the May 8th surrender. They then took incomplete G-10 airframes and produced them with DB605D engines. This was called the S-99. They later mated a quantity of Jumo engines with the airframe with extensive modifications from the firewall forward. These were called S-199. There was also a two place trainer. I'm not sure of the designation off the top of my head, but I think it was the S-199S. A group of S-199 machines was sold to the new Israeli state after the beginning of the 1948 Independence War. As the Israelis were desperate for anything, they used it but it was called "the Mule" because of its awful handling/flying characteristics. They were quickly phased out ASAP in favor of Spitfire and Mustangs.

Yugoslavia used several WNF built G-10 machines for a short period, but quickly went to USSR equipment under Tito. The G-10 at the old Planes Of Fame Museum and the USAF Museum are ex-Yugoslavia machines. Jerry Crandall and others did a lot of research/work on these machines years ago.

Lastly, Spain had a quantity of G-6 machines from Germany before the war ended. When the war was over they ran out of DB engines and substituted RR Merlin engines in two different configurations. Some of these were used in the 1970s Battle Of Britain film and are presently with the Heritage AF (aka the former Confederate AF) in the USA.

There were likely brief uses of 109s in other venues, but the information escapes me at the moment!

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Thank you John :) As I know two seat CSSR produced version with Jumo engine were designated CS-199. Interesting to hear about Mr. Crandall research work on preserved machine, any data available?

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Hello Srecko
Finnish AF had appr. 100 war-weary 109Gs immediately after the war and they were used in ever diminishing numbers up to 1954 as the main and the only fighter. In fact they were the only combat a/c we had from 1948 to 1954. In 1954 we bought 6 DH Vampire Mk 52s and in 1955 9 Vampire Trainer Mk. 55s.

Juha

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Interesting and long service after the war. As well it was main combat airplane, this mean most frequent use so that require spare parts. Did Finland have it? I guess a lot of that remained after the war.

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

The original Czech intent was to produce them with DB engines. However, after only a few were made, the plant they had (as part of the German re-distribution of manufacturing during the war) was completely destroyed by fire. They had the Jumo engines, but the marriage was not simple, different rotation direction, and HP to weight ratio. It was a force-fit that worked after a fashion for the short term.

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Thanks jedenastka :)

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Thank you Nuppol :)

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

... with the usual Wiki - mistakes.

Only two examples: "Round 550 S-199s were built, including a number of conversion trainers designated CS-199 (armed) and C-210 (unarmed). The first flight took place in March 1947, and production ended in 1949."

1.) C-210 wasn't the desigantion of an unarmed trainer but the designation for S-199 before 1947. In August 1947 the designation was changed from C-10 to S-99, C-110 to CS-99 and C-210 to S-199 (it was the C-210.1, the prototype). The CS-199 had never another designation because the first a/c was flown after August 1947. (Look --- there is an contradiction between the Wiki-text and the Wiki-version list.)

2.) The first flight was on 25 April 1947, 02.32 pm, and not in March.The production ended 1951 with the S-199.543. The last CS-199, the CS-199.582 was delivered on 22 September 1950.

Have a look on the sources --- there is not one source in Czech language.

Best regards
Rasmussen

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

You are right Rasmussen, Wiki could make in many cases mistakes but I guess they could be edited.

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Rumania built the Bf 109G also post-war and used them up until 1956.

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Their Bf109 as I know have different bulge on nose, a bit larger. But no idea why, maybe some specific equipment under the skin?

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

Hungary also used the Me109 wartime...

The Spaniards did not have the G6...it was the G2 only (1942) when they bought the license.

Mike

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

During war time or after?

Re: Bf109 after the war
 

No idea, I have just seen image of this area but no idea about the date. Look like direct conversion of G-6 model.

Interesting that non of them remained in East Germany, I get info before that they used two Fw190D as trainers until late '40, and just wonder about any Bf109 ( I already get reply about this in previous page)