Scrapped planes after WWII
 

I've heard that many aircraft passed from assembly lines directly to scrapyards, due to the impossibility to stop the frantic activity of US factories all at once after the war had ended.

Is it true?

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

No, not at all.

Where did you hear of this nonsense? :confused:

Stephen

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Franz - This is correct. Many of them were purchased by scrap dealers for the metal and Aviation Fuel. Some were purchased at auctions for various uses. Many were scrapped in Kingman and Tucson,Arizona, Walnut Ridge ,
Arkansas , Stillwater , Oklahoma by the U.S. Government. The Navy dumped many in the ocean and others were destroyed in other countries.
Most of these were bombers and some fighters. New P -51s and F4U Corsairs were retained by Armed Forces as were B - 29s ,a few B - 17s
and new Transports.
Mike

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

IMHO shoshoobaby's reply is not correct in the sense that the "franti c activity" of US factories could not be stopped all at once. Many of the aircraft at Kingman were actually flown back from the Pacific theater, for example. Since the end date of the war was unpredictable, war effort continued right up to and following V-J day. Some aircraft had been taken out of production prior to that time but many of the newer types, B-29, A-26, P-80 etc. did not shut down at all, although in most cases the rate was cut back. Understand that even in WWII, the time from the start of manufacturing, i.e.,cutting aluminum, forging blanks, etc. to final assembly was from months to nearly a year. Because of these lead times, when the stop orders came there would be components all the way from aluminum sheet stampings up to completed aircraft in the chain. IIRC, most of this material went directly to scrap dealers and local salvage companies. Thousands of aircraft were scrapped or abandoned around the world, USA, GB, German, Jap, etc. There was just very little use for combat aircraft for several years following the end of WW II, the best were kept and the rest disposed of.

Best regards,

Artie Bob

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

From biography of Bob Sturges , WW II Test Pilot for Boeing. Post WW II he delivered several B - 17s purchased from bone yards.Flew the famous B -17 to Portland , Oregon that was mounted over a Gas station.It is still there. These aircraft were brand new and the unsold ones were mostly scrapped . Many that were purchased were for the aviation fuel. The tanks were drained and the aircraft was re- sold to a scrap dealer.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Many factories continued production of unnecessary tools of war just because not to dramatically increase unemployment ratio and allow economy to convert to peace terms. This is politics and I have heard a lot of complaints that it has nothing to aircraft.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

As I lived though that period in the USA, my memory is quite clear that military production was stopped very quickly. This was because in 1945 and 1946 in the USA, there was plenty of demand for automobiles , refrigerators, new houses, etc., etc.. The USA economy was very strong because it had been almost 100% employed during the war and because of rationing, cost controls, the unavailability of most consumer items there were both great demand and lots of saved up cash available. Remember the ability of the USA to produce so much military equpment so fast was that the consumer oriented industries such as automobiles, appliances and electronics was that these huge industries were able to convert completely to military production very quickly. IIRC correctly the first real slowdown here did not occur for several years, around 1948-9 and it did not last very long. If there was any "artificial" pumping of the economy it probably was the GI bill, which turned out to be one of the best investments any government has made to improve the economy.

Best regards,

Artie Bob

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Franz - In the new March / April Warbirds Magazine there is a review of the new book " Surplus WW II Aircraft " by William Larkins. A lot of pictures and information.
Mike

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Many thanks, I'll try and get it.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

A friend of mine was a B-24 pilot during the war. After completing his 35 missions he came back to the States as an Instructor and Ferry pilot. He told me at the end of the war he had flown brand new B-25's right from the factory to storage yards in Arizona to be scrapped.

As an example of how quick things could wind down, FG-1D Corsair production at Goodyear shutdown the second week of Sept. 45.
In May 45 the Navy excepted 302 from Vought & 195 from Goodyear, July 45 the Navy excepted 303 from Vought & 180 from Goodyear. Sept. saw 41 from Vought & 68 from Goodyear.

Regards,
Mike

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

The Canadian experience was similar to what was described above. Some aircraft, especially Cornells and Bolingbrokes, that were delivered to the RCAF late in the war went direct into storage. They were sold off over the next few years, some for scrap, and some with ten hours or less airframe time. The storage sites also held reserve aircraft from earlier orders, and I've heard stories of Tiger Moths, Ansons, Hurricanes and others being sold in the years right after the war in virtually new condition. For example, Fleet Fort 3563, delivered on 15 July 1941, had 57 hours went it was transferred for sale on 5 February 1945. In contrast, numer 3564 was delivered the same month, to a Flying School, and had 1,566 hours when transferred in March of 1945.

There were large numbers of Waco troop gliders in Canada in packing crates at the end of the war, waiting shipment to operational units, that were sold still in the crate. Apprently the boxes made great chicken coops, and many of the gliders were thrown away by the new owners who just wanted the sturdy wooden crate.

Fairchild Aircraft of Canada continued to build Bolingbroke airframes at a low rate after the BCATP orders were cut back in late 1944, in hopes that the RCAF would eventually buy them. After the war they finally sold several dozen complete airframes, less government supplied engines, for scrap, without ever flying them. By the way, if anybody out there knows the exact number of airframes, or when they were finally sold, I would love to hear from them.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Some pics of the Oklahoma Birds..

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Gentlemen,

I have been researching USAAF Air Technical Intelligence in the ETO. One veteran interviewed in the UK traveled with the advancing US forces into Germany. He mentioned discovering a Junker bomber plant that the US Army swept past during their advance. This ATI veteran spoke with the director of the aircraft factory and ordered him to have his workers return to the plant and keep working on the Junker bomber production line.

The veteran stated that eventually, after the German surrender, many factories in Germany would be utilized to produce material for the war against Japan. Therefore, the Allies wanted German aircraft factories fully functioning for eventual conversion towards producing material in this effort.

The director of the Junker aircraft factory was instructed to have the factory workers return to work, and the US Army would pay their salary. The Allies wanted to keep thus particular aircraft factory production in force.

The American veteran, Ford Porter enlisted in the RCAF, transfered to the USAAF and flew Beaufighters with 415 Squadron in the MTO and later transfered to the 25th BG at Watton and flew de Havilland Mosquito aircraft with 653rd Squadron. At the end of the war, he again transfered to ATI to assist as US forces moved deeper into Germany. He died four years ago in the UK from lung cancer.

Norman Malayney

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

IMHO, this is a case of, at best a rather befuddled memory in old age. First, virtually all Junkers bomber production had been stopped months before the war ended by the Germans in order to concentrate resources on other types. Second, USA did not need any German aircraft production capacity or any German types for the war in the Pacific, USA production rationalization and cutbacks had actually begun before V-E day. The only Junkers bomber production that continued after capitulation was in France and that had nothing to do with US forces (see the book "Junkers 88 et 188 Francais" for the full story). Third, if you look at the location of the Junkers production facilities, IIRC, most if not all ended up in the USSR occupation zone, where the US Army Air Force had very little authority. The USSR continued development of some Junker jet bomber types, but none of thes were apparently ever produced in quantity, but that is another story. Sorry, this appears to be another of the many wars end myths with little or no substance.

Best regards,

Artie Bob

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Hi all;

It´s true that ´more than thusand´ B-17 and B-24 were flown back to the USA via Iceland, Greenland and Canada in May, June, July 1945 - only to be parked at f.e. at Kingman and elsewhere - and scrapped.

489 ´White Project´ aircraft passing through Meeks Field (Keflavík) in May 1945. These were 189 B-17, 288 B-24 and 12 Consolidated OA-10 Catalina. First to arrive was on 20 May. That was B-17G 44-83484 with tew man crew. That day most came in one day (71) all B-17 and B-24 continiued over the next few days. On the 23 May many passing through Greenland, 63 landed at Narsarsuaq but most flew over to Goose Bay.

At the same time eastbound were nine B-24 Liberator bombers. During same period the British ferrying increased through Reykjavik, mostly Mosquito to UK.

Statistic for May 1945: During May 1945 there were 841 arrivals to Meeks Field (Keflavík). Of that 306 were four engined C-54 transports. Also 2 twin engined transports. There arrived 486 four engined and 29 twin engined Bombers. Other planes were 18. One C-54 (American Airlines) with injured soldiers returned to Meeks Field at night on the 15th because of broken exhaust. The pipe from cylinder one on number four engine was broken and had damaged the engine. It took three hours to repair. Only nine B-24 Liberator bombers were eastbound before VE-Day.
On VE-Day five USN PB4Y Liberators were at Meeks Field on their way to Europe. They were ordered to return but 11 C-46 Commando transports and 7 C-47 Skytrain proceeded. The 16 other planes were AACS or Special Mission. The British stopped using Camp Geck at Meeks Field (Keflavík) during the month. The traffic was slow untill the 20th when traffic picked up, now in the opposite direction - Westbound!

During June 1945 there arrived 1370 aircraft at Meeks Field (Keflavík). These were 1073 four engined and 4 twin engined Bombers. Also 266 four engined transport aircraft and 27 others. The Bombers came all from Prestwick in Scotland or Valley in Wales. They only stopped for fuel, then proceeded to Goose Bay, Labrador, then Bradley Field, Connecticut. During the month American Weather planes flew every other day from Gander to til Meeks Field (Keflavík). These were B-17 from the 53rd (LR) Weather Reconnaissance Squadron. Two aircraft, B-17G 9106 and 9149, searched for an lost Canadian aircraft near Greenland during the month.

For July 1945 is the following RAF TAC Prestwick controlled flights: 1545 (343 direct, 1108 via Iceland, 2 via Greenland, 64 via Azores, 1 Sweden, 10 Iceland to/from Sweden, 1 Amsterdam, 2 Norway, 15 Russian deliveries)
(123 RAF deliveries: including 3 Westbound, 602 transport/weather, 759 USAAF Westbound, 15 Russia deliveries, 15 to/from Russia, 1 delivery to France, 2 flights by Iceland Airways: Catalina TF-ISP making the first Icelanders flown passenger flight)

cheers
ed

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Some of the B-17 in the photos Hemiman posted have unit markings. Isn't that odd for brand new aircraft? I wouldn't expect factories to spray on the unit markings.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Many or most of those flown home had their old unit markings still applied when flown back home, factories did not, I belive, paint those. Rather you, Skayraider, are looking at ex-ETO operational B-17. Most of those ended up at Kingman etc.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

More photos:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=170026409838
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=170026408234
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=170026409081
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=170026410684
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=330025657424



Usual disclaimer,
Ed

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Very interesting! That P-40 graveyard is a work of art! :D

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

To Ed:

Then I can safely state that Valley was an allied air base, with U.S., Czech and other allied planes using it?


Larry Daley

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

hello all,
i know from aplace here in belgium after the war there was a dump were planes were collected from everywere.up to the 50th you could still see piles of them you had a hard time to see the church tower.
at a german dump planes came out of the east countries until 70-80 to be scrapted.
its still unbelieveble what can be found even today but you have to go to east countries

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Nonsense. There was a shortage of aluminum in the Eastern Block, and almost everything was melted down. Most of the recoveries from 'the East' are aircraft and tanks illegally removed from remote areas.

Re: Scrapped planes after WWII
 

Hello wranek,
maybe in poland that was the case to collect alu coz of the shortage,but as i have contacts in some east countries I know about what i am talking.
even last year i collected german airplane parts in chech rep.
even in russia remoted area's you have to be surprised what still can be recovered those days left behind by russian and german forces,i saw it all on video taken by russians who visited my place here only a few years ago.!
3 years ago i recovered luftwaffe items that came from a dump in germany
and i have the evidence from this.
its like with everything you have to know the contacts and the places.
I have been to norway on wrecks,thanks to local guides and with cooperation of norweagan air force we were able to come to those wrecks.if you go to norway and tour around and you don't know anything you can drive around for a year without finding it.
all this is talking about personal experience and not from "i have heard from people..."
kindly regards
phil