Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Probably something very obvious but I have never seen this on the nose of a Do 17 Z before; can anyone enlighten us?

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

An earlier version of Seenotausrüstung ? [Z-5 version]
HTH
Giampiero Piva

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

My thoughts as well

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

It appears to have a few other non standard sensors etc in this and the uncropped eBay photo... Seems a bit ott for simply adding flotation devices. Complete deletion and re-skinning of the starboard cockpit side windows. Different location to the standard floatations device on the starboard side. I think there's more to this strange Do17Z personally.

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

A weather recco plane ?

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

I would tend to agree with Clint and Von Alles on this one... the 'standard' position for the flotation device container on the starboard side was aft of the set of windows this housing covers. This fitment would appear to have an opening at the front which suggests to me that whatever was inside may have been a) taking a reading from the airflow outside the aircraft and b) situated over the original window area as it clearly was, may have been deliberately positioned there in order that it could be seen/accessed/manipulated more easily by a crew member.

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

The port wing also has two sensor/pitot tubes instead of just the standard one... Clearly a lot more apparatus for checking conditions whilst in flight than standard. I did look in the Wekusta book, but found nothing similar with regard to this strange apparatus. Although in fairness this could be the first time this particular aircraft has been photographed. Looks like it may have been on the ground a while, left unattended as the majority of the skin on the ailerons and flaps is missing. Snowy conditions, not sure if that has any relevance though.

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Sorrry Clint,
but you refer to details invisible in the photo above. It's possible, please, to see the entire image?
Many thanks in advance
Giampiero Piva

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

As a former weather observer, I must opine that this installation is clearly a psychrometer housing used to measure ambient temperature and relative humidity. I searched for a confirming illustration of this housing in the book:

Vocke, Dr. Ernst. Die Wetterflieger (Zweibrücken: VDM Heinz Nickel Verlag, 2002). ISBN: 3-925480-61-7.

but there was none shown for the Do 17Z - although they do show a very large Pitot tube (thermal probe?) projecting out the front of the nose. However this looks in line with those seen applied to the He 111.

I conclude that this is a weather recon plane.

DGS

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Hi Piero,

It is still available as a preview on the original eBay auction here, picked up via the 04/02/2015 (Bombers) eBay trawl on the Luftwaffe Research Group here. :)

Thank you Doug for confirmation.

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Interesting-thanks all. It looks like the original sale was broken up. Bit of a mixture of photos-wonder what unit & date?

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

There's what looks like a "V" outboard of the cross on the port wing underside. Sadly not a lot else to confirm identity. Hopefully others can...

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

I guess the designation should be Do 17 Z-6 since that is labelled as "Wetterflugzeug"

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

I think I understand what Clint means by 'snowy conditions', with the view from behind showing the aircraft with what may seem like a winter colour scheme, but I don't think this aircraft had that type of scheme applied to it at the time of this photo.

To me, the view from the rear looks more like staining either from dirt thrown up from a nearby bomb blast - which perhaps contributed to the damage in the first place - or maybe from some form of fire-retardant spray/foam used to try and douse flames from the wing, given the damage on the upper wing. There's also similar 'staining' around the forward nose area below the cockpit on the (R) side.

I agree the last letter under the wing looks like a 'V' but sadly, the accompanying images don't really offer any clues as they are so varied... a LaGG 1(?, or some such type - I initially thought it was a Dewoitine D520), SM82 'Marsupiale' and some other fire-damaged aircraft (swithering between a Ju88 and Blenheim!)

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Yes Paul, I believe it could well be foam instead of a light dusting of snow. Makes sense given what we're looking at.

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Mikael,

Are you sure?
Acc. to "The warpalnes of the Third Reich" page 120, my 'bible', Do 17Z-6 was an Do 17Z-3 with the nose cone of the Ju 88C-2. And only one piece build. See appendix.

Jaap

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Hi all,
according to 'Vom original zum Modell' [Bernard & Graefe Verlag] the Z-6 was a pure weather recce plane.
For many years (I'm 66 years old) the W. Green's book was for me also 'the bible', but some of the informations are too much old and no longer adequate. The W.Green's Z-6 Ithink is a Z-7 Kauz.
Giampiero Piva

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Pretty sure it was Jørn Junker who posted a period German document which confirmed the following:

Do 17 Z-6 Wetterflugzeug
Wie Z-2, Jedoch zusätzlich 2 x 228 Liter Kraftstoff ohne Bewaffnung

(Copied verbatim)

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Btw, what is the original source of the idea that the early Kauz had a C-2 nose cone? Surely the the striking difference between the forward fuselage cross section shape of the Do17Z and the forward fuselage cross section shape of the Ju88 would mean that simply grafting on a Ju88C-2 weapon bay/nose cone onto a Do17Z would not be possible?

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Jaap, I wouldn't trust a single word in that book. Its not even in my library! :-)

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

Mikael,
remember that the W.Green's books were for a generation of enthusiasts and modelers the only source disposable - Today, as I said, are outdated (like many others written in more recent times!)
Regards
Giampiero Piva

Re: Box on Nose of Do 17 Z
 

I'm well aware of the Giampiero. And undoubtly that book together with some other early books have inspired many people, including myself to become seriously interested in this field of the history. That contribution should of course be duly acknowlegded with appreciation.