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Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Hi Guy's,
Today I am searching for the loss details of Hptm. Karl Neumaier Gefallen am 21.04.1945 bei Sagan. He flew with KG 53 and later JG 7. Can anyone help further please? Kind regards, Melvin www.aircrewremembrancesociety.co.uk |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
http://www.x19world.de/fleiger/me262.einsaete.htm
This site has an "Obltn. Neumar" as Ia of I./JG7. I have seen no other reference to this person. Unfortunately I have no information on Hptm. Neumaier. |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Dear Melvin,
unfortunately there is no Hauptmann Karl Neumaier listed as pilot at JG 7. These are names of pilot JG 7 first letter N : Major Johannes Naumann Ofhr. Neugebauer Ofhr. Josef Neuhaus FjOfw. Klaus Neumann Oblt. Neumar Gefr. Hermann Notter Oblt. Karl Nordbruch Maybe a member of the ground crew? My source: Chronik Jagdgeschwader 7 by Manfred Boehme Herzliche Grüsse aus Oberschwaben, Wolfgang |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Dear Karoband,
The link that you provided seems to be all about cars, not aircraft, and that was found only by shortening the URL. As you presented it, it doesn't seem to exist. Regards, Richard |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
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Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Thanks, Matti. My apologies.
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Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Hmmm.................
I have notified Doug on this to see if he has any recollections concerning our two NEUMAIER entries and the absence of a NEUMAR entry. All it takes is a single misspelling in an original document, or later on by researchers and/or authors and the error gets perpetuated into eternity! I think our NEUMAIER entries come from two separate sources, so this is indeed odd. Notice in the Manfred Boehme list given above how the first name is missing from NEUMAR yet the first names are given for the others in the list. This raises questions as to where Boehme got the name and that it may have been from someone's postwar recollections and not from a document. The name NEUMAR almost seems to be a phonetic reproduction from soneone's memory. L. |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Hi Guy's
Thanks to everyone so far for their help so far. Have attached an image of Neumaier, his calling card and burial. Was originally with KG 53, so maybe we can trace his movements from there? Kind regards to all, Melvin www.aircrewremembrancesociety.co.uk |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
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Sagan was occupied by the Soviets in Februray 1945; maybe Neumaier died as POW? Regards Heuser |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Melvin,
A Hptm. Karl NEUMAIER, A1 (Tr.O.), is listed on p.191 of the Dienstaltersliste der Offiziere der Deutschen Luftwaffe nach dem Stande vom 1. August 1944. There is no listing for anyone by the name of NEUMAR. Hptm. Karl NEUMAIER is also listed on p.150 of Patzwall , Klaus D. Die Luftwaffen-Rangliste 1945. Norderstedt: Militair-Verlag Klaus D. Patzwall, 1986. Hb. 225p. Index. Again, there is no listing for anyone by the name of NEUMAR. NEUMAIER is mentioned just twice in the KG 53 unit history (Kiehl, Heinz. Kampfgeschwader “Legion Condor” 53": Eine Chronik – Berichte, Erlebnisse, Dokumente, 1936-1945. Stuttgart: Motorbuch Verlag, 1983. ISBN: 3-87943-947-8. Hb. Dj. 388p. Illus. Maps. Appendices. Bibliography. Names index.), on pages 48 and 53. Both entries refer to him as an Oblt. belonging to 8. Staffel in September 1939 while based at Gross-Ostheim near Aschaffenburg. No further mention in the book and no mention of a NEUMAR. L. |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Hi,
there was an ebay auction in April 2012 with some photos of Karl Neumaier taken out from an album including the one shown in this thread. On the back of one of the photos following written information: Born 17.01.1915 in Munich(?) and "Gefallen am 21.IV.1945 bei Sagan" (KIA on 21th April near Sagan). My Interpretation: Not shot down or crashed while on board of an aircraft, but KIA on the ground in fight against the Russians. Sagan (Zagan, Poland)-Küpper was an airfield where test / development flights for Ar234 jet bomber were performed. Maybe Neumaier was in charge of testing the Ar234 or assigned to FLÜG1 or KG76? Regards, Karl |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
No mention of Neumaier in the JG 7 unit history below, but an oblique reference to an “Oblt. Neumar” appears in a Liste der Flugzeugführer des Jagdgeschwaders 7 on page 257 but nowhere else in the book:
Boehme, Manfred. Jagdgeschwader 7: Die Chronik eines Me 262-Geschwaders 1944/45. Stuttgart: Motorbuch Verlag, 1983. ISBN: 3-87943-925-7. Hb. Dj. 291p. Illus. Tables. Appendices. Bibliography. A more recent, more authoritative but shorter history of JG 7 also fails to mention Neumaier but does identify the mysterious “Oblt. Neumar” at Ia of I./JG 7: Jurleit, Manfred. Strahljäger Me 262 im Einsatz: Alle Geschwader, Gruppen und Kommandos. Berlin: Transpress Verlagsgesellschaft, 1993. ISBN: 3-344-70778-7. Hb (card cover). 199p. Heavily illus. Tables. Appendices. Glossary. Source notes. So, basically, we have little or no evidence of Neumaier’s service record after September 1939. I strongly suggest you contact BA-MA for a copy of his personnel file, these usually running 10-25 pages, or a copy of his 2-4 page Karteikarte that lists his assignments. I agree with Karl (the post preceding this one) that some time after Neumaier was promoted to Hptm. by the Luftwaffe in 1942, he was seconded to the Army or Waffen-SS. The may have happened in September 1944 when many of the Fliegerschulen were disbanded and the personnel sent off to the ground forces. Being with the administrative or instructor cadre with the Fliegerschulen would also explain why there is so little about him in the surviving documents. |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
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Regards, Melvin www.aircrewremembrancesociety.co.uk |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Melvin wrote in part:
Quote:
L. |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
Larry,
Thank you very much for your kind words regarding our remembrance website, really appreciate that! Thanks also for your advice regarding BA, will give that a go and see what happens. Regards, Melvin www.aircrewremembrancesociety.co.uk |
Re: Hptm. Karl Neumaier JG 7 + 21.04.1945
I have ordered about 100+ Personalaktes with in total almost 6,000 pages. Not a problem for officers who have been killed or died >30 years ago. Others are more difficult, especially the ones who entered the Bundesluftwaffe after 1956.
Cheers, John Ps. Not cheap though.... |
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