Anton Hackl
 

Good morning Gentlemen,

I'm trying to find out more about Anton Hackl.
http://luftwaffe.cz/hackl.html
http://cieldegloire.fr/001_hackl_a.php
https://www.lesasdelaluftwaffe.fr/jg...v-anton-hackl/

Can anybody tell me if he flew a Bf109 or an Fw190 in February1945 with Stab/JG300 ?

Cheers,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Hello Michael.
Given he was flying 190A's since Feb 1944, I would be staggered if he flew one of the few, if any, 109's of Stab JG300 in Feb 1945. But if you're looking for certainty ......... sorry.
Peter

Re: Anton Hackl
 

I've read that he had both: a Fw 190 for bomber intercept and a Me 109 for fighter work.

I can't remember the source, but I'm sure of it.

Bronc

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Some aviation artist made that comment when he painted a pic of Hackl in a BF-109 intercepting a Bomber Stream; I think he was referring to Hackl's time as head honcho of JG-11 (or was it head honcho of III/JG-11); Sorry I cannot say more on the matter, but Hackl is one of my favorite Jagdwaffe 'personalities'.

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good morning,

John Weal indicated that Hackl used both the Bf109 and the Fw190 at the same period.
https://www.amazon.de/Focke-Wulf-Ace...der_1855325950

Cheers,
Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Weal was quoting Bernd Barbas. Page 69 of Planes of the Luftwaffe Fighter Aces Volume 1 (the older Kookaburra technical publications edition). There are two photos of interest on the page - one shows a Bf109 captioned as having 132 victories on the rudder and the other shows a mechanic applying Hackl's 141st victory to the rudder of an Fw190. The 109 is depicted in double-spread artwork within the same volume.

The info is duplicated on Page 98 of Volume I of the the newer (Schiffer) edition of that two part series.

Do yourself a big favour - move on from Weal's 190 Aces of the Western Front book. It is a bad source as the noted historian Donald Caldwell (author of the JG 26 War Diary and JG 26 Top Guns of the Luftwaffe) pointed out on the earlier incarnation of this forum.

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Is a clear date given for these two photos ?

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Thanks for the detailed info on the references Nick.
Using that info I checked my copies of Weal's book and Schiffer's Luftwaffe Aces vol1.
The FW190/Bf109 info relates to Hackl's time with JG11 in 1944. The FW190 photo is dated April 11 1944, but whether the date was simply "guessed" by counting the kill markings and then checking the date on which Hackl had that number, I can't say.
Unfortunately, the Bf109G-6 pic has no date. Given it shows 132 kills, that would suggest January 1944, but there's nothing to confirm this.
Peter

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Hello Peter,

thanks for your assessment.
A different kind of primary source is Hackl's rudder
http://www.axiswarprize.com/anton-hackl.html
which reveals that he was transferred away from the Russian front after 118 kills.

Have a nice weekend,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

11 April 1944 is the date of Hackl's 141st according to older lists, Peter, so your theory of that date looks correct. As for his 132nd, 11 January 1944 is correct by the older lists so the 'he flew one of each concurrently' story is looking a little shaky - exactly 3 months difference between the two dates leaves me asking where the story really came from. Perhaps Hackl said it to Barbas in an interview that we cannot obtain.

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Interesting - older lists give his 118th as a Spitfire on 7th January 1943 at 1145am. 7km SW of Sirte airfield @ 6-7000m, which corresponds to 92 sqn. ER279 of F/S T R Broomhall MIA and serial unknown Sgt. H Patterson (baled out). That would be a slight overclaim as Burkhardt and Reinert also claimed ( = 3 claims, but only two losses...)

Re: Anton Hackl
 

I can confirm he flew both, BF109 to intercept fighters, Fw190 for bombers.

Bernd Barbas knew him quite well, and this is what he told Bernd. Apparently he should only have had one aircraft, but would say his own was faulty, so would have to use the other.......seemed to work for him.

Regards

Johannes

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Johannes,
At this stage the only period we have information on this practice is in the first half of 1944.
Are you able to confirm that the practice continued after that - ie after he left JG11 in mid-1944?
Peter

Re: Anton Hackl
 

That's true, Peter...
But here's another spanner in the works and hopefully a worthy and useful one.

On 23 December, 1944, Hackl claimed (as CO II./JG 26):

1) A P-51. Caldwell tell us that this was a Mustang from 364th FG which forcelanded on allied side of the lines. Please note, I cannot find an entry in losses of the 8th & 9th Air Forces that actually backs that up.

2) A Lancaster from 405 sqn, RCAF or 582 sqn. (582 sqn lost 5 Lancasters and the 6th was from 405 sqn)

3) A Mosquito: ML998/HS-B of 109 sqn (Caldwell says 105 sqn). F/O E C Carpenter RCAF and F/O W T Lambeth DFM both KIA

In return,
5 Staffel lost Lt. Helmut Wirth WIA in Fw190D-9 W.Nr. 210614

8 Staffel lost Fw. Werner Frass in Fw190D-9 W.Nr. 210168

...So there's at least 2, very possibly 3, legitimate victories that can reasonably be said to have been achieved by Hackl in the Dora 9

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Nick, if the claims are correct, then they were almost certainly in a D. JG26 converted to D's in Nov 1944, and their remaining A's were either lost in accidents or transferred out, probably early in December.

Getting back to Michael's question about JG300, Hackl was only credited with 1 kill with this unit - in Feb 1945.

There are only 5 JG300 kills recorded in Feb 1945 - the one to Hackl as a Stab pilot and 4 listing the pilot as unknown and simply stating the unit as JG300.

The uncertainty regarding the a/c Hackl was flying when he made that claim lies in online sources (no doubt one copied the other) stating that in the period Dec-Apr 1945, Stab JG300 had FW190A and Bf109G. The G's they had in Oct and Nov were G-14's. BUT the movement and on-hand info only lists FW190A in Dec 1944. Unfortunately, there is no more detailed info after that, so if Stab JG300 did indeed get more Bf109G's in 1945, we have no idea when or how many. Note Hackl was GeK from 30 Jan to 20 Feb only.

Lexikon der Wehrmacht states I and III Gruppen had Bf109G, Stab and II FW190A, but doesn't say if this was for the whole of its existence, at inception, or whenever.

That does not rule out the possibility that he simply commandeered a Bf109G from one of the Gruppen whenever he felt like it.

Does anyone have the 2 JG300 volumes by Lorant and Goyat? Maybe the answer is there.

Peter

Re: Anton Hackl
 

I have the Lorant and Goyat volumes - he gets the very briefest of mentions in them and there's definitely nothing to answer the original question in that sense.
I do definitely agree with your assertion that his claims with JG 26 that I listed were most likely made in a Dora. After all, if an Unteroffizier and a Feldwebel were KIA that day in Doras, then surely the Kommandeur would hardly be flying an older type Anton (that's my logic and I take it you agree). If you would like to view my copies of Lorant and Goyat, send me a PM

Re: Anton Hackl
 

If it's any help, the equipment of Stab JG 300 on 7 November 1945 was a mixture of Fw 190 A-8 and Bf 109 G-14/AS: http://www.ghostbombers.com/markings/IJK071144.html

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Hi Nick B. I guess you mean 1944.
Movement info suggests one only Bf109G-14 which was sent for overhaul sometime during November - by your info we now know it was after 7 Nov.
I guess we don't know if it came back after December?
Peter

Re: Anton Hackl
 

I do, I'm pretty sure that Stab JG 300 no longer had any Bf 109 G-14/AS in November 1945!

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good morning,

this website indicates that Peter Jenne of Stab/JG300 was lost in a Bf109G on 2Mar1945.
http://www.jg300.de/loss1945-1.html

Cheers,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Great JG300 site Michael. Why didn't I even think of something so simple??
The info on the site confirms what I posted earlier from Lexikon der Wehrmacht - if you click on the links for the Gruppen you'll see I and III were Bf109, II was FW190, all from beginning to end. Unfortunately the site is silent on Stab.
The Osprey Elite Units 20 Sturmgruppen book has considerable commentary up until December 1944, then very little because the concept was shelved due to the overwhelming opposition.
It does say that the Sturmgruppen provided their own fighter cover, which explains the mix of FW90 and Bf109 - the FW to go after the bombers and the Bf to keep the fighters busy.
If we knew what a/c Hackl shot down it might give a clue, but that would still leave us without confirmation.
Back to the JG300 website, I had a bit of a laugh when I saw a loss on 24/12/44 - Anton Hack in a Bf109G14AS! Hackl wasn't there then .........
Cheers

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good afternoon Peter,

I don't think that Uffz. Anton Hack is Anton Hackl.

We have Stab/JG300 losses on 31Dec1944 and 2Mar1945, both Bf109G's.
Thus, we can assume that Hackl, who scored between those dates, might have flown a Messerschmitt as well.

Is there any evidence that Hackl scored any JG76 kills ?

Cheers,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Hello Michael.
I wasn't suggesting Hack was Hackl. As I said, Hackl wasn't there yet. I just found it somewhat amusing there might be 2 with almost identical names in the same unit at the same time. I wouldn't have thought that name would be all that common.
I'm not sure there is any proof of his kills from 22 May 1944 to 28 Oct 1944. I certainly don't have any. Only what is repeated on several sites - 16 kills.
Cheers!

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good morning Peter,

unfortunately, that website
http://ww2.dk/oob/bestand/jagd/bstjg300.html
indicates that there were no Bf109's at Stab/JG300 in December 1944. :-(

Does Jochen Prien's book
https://www.amazon.de/Jagdgeschwader...T21VFM899VH8TB
make a statement regarding the JG11 total of Anton Hackl ?

Cheers,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Michael, that goes back to my post #18 - the sole Bf109G-14 was sent for overhaul some time after 7 November, but because the movement records stop in December, we don't know if it came back to the unit in January or later, or if it went elsewhere.
Peter

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good morning Peter,

does a photo of Hackl's Fw190D exist ?

Cheers,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Sorry Michael, I'm not aware of any for either Stab II./JG26 or Stab JG11. Not for lack of trying.
Cheers

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good afternoon,

does Jochen Prien's book
https://www.amazon.de/Jagdgeschwader...T21VFM899VH8TB
make a statement regarding the JG11 total of Anton Hackl ?

Cheers,

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Good evening,

I'm still interested in opinions about if Hackl's single JG300 kill was more likely scored in a Bf109 or in an Fw190.

Michael

Re: Anton Hackl
 

Anton Hackl is a promising candidate for the top-scoring Fw 190D pilot, isn't he?