US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

Dear all

I am trying to determine which US single engine fighter crashed at the beginning of September 1944 at Savigny (Dept 69: west of Lyon).

Pilot killed.

It would be a P47, which seems confirmed by the shape of the wing you can see on the picture.

Any hint ?

Thanks a lot

GC

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

If the crash occurred behind enemy lines there should be a MACR.
https://www.aviationarchaeology.com/.../44SepMACR.htm


If it is a P-47, a page search (Ctrl+F) of 09/44 will provide MACR's for the Month, there's 130.
http://p-47.database.pagesperso-oran...abase/MACR.htm


If the crash occurred within Allied territory it would be classified as an accident.
https://www.aviationarchaeology.com/...y/Sep1944O.htm

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

Looks like the serial number has "23" so a/c would be 43-2####
Macr 8989 or 8690 may be a starting point ?
September 10th 44.

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

I just learnt that crash occurred between 8 and 11 September (when the school starts: the witness was a kid then) so, it would match.

The zone where it crashed was within Allied Territory.

It seems (TBC) that pilot bailed out too low and was killed;

Friends will soon go on site, to look for further information. We will maybe have more data in the next days or weeks;

GC

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

I must be missing something, where is there a 23?

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

There were no Ninth Air Force P-47 losses/deaths that I can find between September 8 and 11, 1944 which match a pilot bailing out in Allied territory. Same for Eighth Air Force P-47's. Is everyone positive this plane is a P-47? I also don't see a 2 or 3 anywhere but am getting old. A 367th Fighter Group P-38 crashed with fatal results after taking off on September 8 (south of Le Mans) and on September 11 some Ninth Air Force P-47's were lost over Allied territory by pilots bailing out, but none were killed.

Kent

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

A local website puts the date on 8 Sep 1944: http://www.lasaporaille.fr/index.php?page=sp_avi

Pilot still listed on the MIA list?

Regards,
Leendert

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

On September 8, the Ninth Air Force lost only 3 planes due to combat related causes. The 367th FS P-38 I mentioned earlier, a P-51 from the 354th FG near La Frette due to flak, and a 404th FG P-47 which went down east of Vise, also due to flak. The 354th and 404th losses have MACRs so they did not come down inside allied lines. In addition, a 354th FG pilot bailed out inside allied lines, a 367th FG P-38 bellied-in inside allied lines and a second pilot bailed out, also in friendly territory, while another 404th FG P-47 bellied-in near Bretigny. Are the people involved positive about this date? No losses fit into it, or the period of September 8-11 unless the story of the pilot being killed is incorrect.

Kent

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

Given the area of the crash the fighter may have been in a unit supporting the drive of the 7th Army and French 1st Army from southern France. I assume the 12th Air Force supported the armies initially. (XII Tactical Air Command?) Later it was the 1st Tactical Air Force (Provisional) but I think it was organized in November 1944. Even though the crash was in September, perhaps we should look at the fighter groups that eventually were assigned to the 1st Tactical Air Force.

https://www.amazon.com/First-TACAF-T.../dp/1891570072

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

I gathered that 27th FG (P-47s) was stationed at not too distant Loyettes airfield in the presumed timeframe.
A unit at Lyon-Bron also a possibility?

Not all airframe losses are mentioned on the usual accident websites. Many aircraft on a combat mission and that crashed within friendly lines are not included for the simple reason it was not an 'ordinary' accident.

Regards,
Leendert

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

I have tried to figure out what possible P-47 Fighter Groups "could" have been involved. Groups were shifted in and out at various times. The 27th FG (as Leendert mentioned) is one possible group. Others would be, I think, the 50th FG, 79th FG, 86th FG, 324th FG, 358th FG and the 371st FG. There were also a couple of French P-47 groups.

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

348th was in the SWPA,368th FGz?

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

Typo on my part s/b 358th FG. Do any others seem in error?


Using September 8, 1944 as the date of death and selecting all Army Air Force men buried in an ABMC cemetery , you get some 33 names.

https://www.abmc.gov/database-search..._last_name_ASC

Looking at just those in Fighter Groups, it would appear that none are in the specific groups on our list. Thus it appears the pilot is not buried overseas.

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

You can rule out the 50th, 358th and 371st. They are included in my Ninth Air Force research.

Kent

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

The war diaries of the 86th FG are all online here:

http://www.86fighterbombergroup.com/War%20diary.htm

They were based on Corsica on Sept 8th (getting ready for a move to Italy). On September 8th the weather was bad and they did not fly any missions.


The 324th FG (see history here): https://www.armyaircorpsmuseum.org/3...hter_Group.cfm

had just moved to Amberieu, France on 6 Sep 1944. Amberieu is just to the NE of Lyon, so not too far away.

Re: US Fighter shot down in Sept. 1944
 

Thanks guys

I am waiting for more information from the village and I let you know when we have more data.

GC