identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Hi all,

on February 28, 1943, at the end of the afternoon, the aerodrome of Maupertus (Cotentin Peninsula) was attacked by Whirlwinds. During this sortie a Fw 190 was shot down and crashed into the sea.
From research I have undertaken it appears not to be a JG 2 fighter.

- what could be the unit of this FW190 and the identity of its german pilot ?


thanks by advance....

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

All I can see is 130 Sqn claimed a Fw 190 off Barfleur 1635hrs-this was shot down trying to shoot down a 263 Sqn Whirlwind which was dive-bombing Maupertus. I can see no corresponding German losses

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Thanks Chris for your input.
it is indeed the 130 squadron. and I too cannot find any correspondence in the documents I have on the LW. this destruction must however be credible since it is commented on in the ORBs of the 602 and 263 squadrons, present during this mission.
the mystery remains intact. I still cannot identify which German unit opposed this dive bombing mission....????
Fred

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

bonjour Frédéric

are you sure of the date ? (28 Feb)

if it was on 27 Feb, we would have two candidates from JG26.

May be worth checking the date and its source.

GC

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Hi Gilles
yes the date is quite certain (February 28, 1943). this destruction is also commented on in the books of John Foreman (Fighter command war diaries and Fighter command victory claims). as well as in the ORBs of 130/602 and 263 sqd. no hesitation then...
thanks for your help.
Fred

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

JG 26 would have been further east. 130 Sqn F540 mentions the claim but no sign of the combat report on line-maybe in Appendices?

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Hello Frédéric,

according to Jagdfliegerverbände Vol. 10/IV page 55 on 28 Feb 1943 the Whirlwinds encountered Fw 190 of the III./JG 2. One Fw 190 is said to have been shot down, but in German documents no proof can be found.

Regards
Leo

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Hi Léo,
it is an excellent track that the one proposed by Jochen Prien. Undoubtedly the answer is it in this direction. I only see JG 2 to intervene on the Maupertus site at this time. but unfortunately, we are not making any progress on the identity of the pilot and his plane.

Chris,
I have already searched well if the 130 sqd had appendices in its ORB, but I did not find any. Did I do it wrong?
what is very surprising is that Eric Mombeek in his book on JG 2 in 1943 makes no allusion to this engagement, nor to the bombardment of Maupertus. he must have a reason, because his works are very well documented.

we have no answer....

thank you for your active participation

Fred

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

ombre time ...

it occurs to me an idea, one of us would have there "Deutsche Luftwaffe Losses & Claims" of Michael Bass. The answer may be in there ?

frédéric

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

I checked Balss' book. No losses for JG 2, only 1 Fw 190 loss in France but it doesn't seem a match:

Jagdlehr.Überpr.Gr. H (non-op flight) Frankreich
Take off
Near Avaray, 35 km southwest of Orleans
Forced landing due engine fire
Fw 190A-2 WNr. 5391 Markings 1+ 100%
P Uffz. Wilhelm Klein KIA (P: JG 105)

That all there is for Fw 190s in France 28 Feb. 1943.

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

I am afraid to say that this appears to be another optimistic claim

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Thanks Steve...

we could imagine that the plane would have been hit without being shot down, and that in a burst of optimism, the British pilots believed it to have been destroyed ... but the problem remains that no German archives mention only the bombing of the base of Maupertus - which cannot be denied. we don't have the key....
not yet ....
frédéric

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Good evening
the significant distance separating the cotention of Orleans forbids to think that there would be a link between these two destructions.
the mystery remains intact. could it be an FW belonging to a training unit?
what were the other JGs (apart from JG 26 which was too far away) which were in France at that time?

good evening and thank you for your input.
Frederic

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

I think we have to be content that this enigma is not going to be solved as such.

However, I also belong to the group who actually think the British pilot hit 'nothing'

First of all a loss in the Orleans area is simply out of the question.

Since the attack on the 28th was on Maupertus the obvious escape by the Whirlwind pilots would have been
to the north. How come the British claim is to the east (and quite a bit to the east) at Barfleur?
I agree that the pilot(s) from 130Sq, obviously covering the mission, could have pursued an attacker east,
but why would any Whirlwind pilot follow after them?
Their job was finished and all that remained for them was to go home/escape as quickly as possible.
So how come they knew anything about the claim made by 130Sq? Why is anything written in their ORBs at all?

Just curious.... :)
Cheers
Stig

Re: identification of a FW190 lost 28 February 1943
 

Hi Stig,
You're right. it is acting wisely to be able to think that what one is certain of may in fact be inaccurate.
here are the elements that I have and which partly answer your questions.
The 263 squadron testified to this destruction of FW in the following context: by starting the dive bombardment, the last Whirlwind found itself isolated, at the tail of the device. it was the one who was attacked by two FWs. the n°2 of the German fighters was targeted and seems to have been destroyed by the fighter of the 130 sqd.
the pilot of the Whirlwind has testified.
the 602 squadron which was in top cover heard and saw that the bombers were in contact with the enemy. He turned around and presented himself as reinforcements. They said they saw the destruction. It's also listed in their ORB.

everyone could be wrong. The German fighter was able to get away with it. According to the account made of this circumstance, he would have fallen into the sea. But who today can be sure?

the only point which is really positive to accredit the thesis of the destruction of this FW, it is that nowhere one finds trace of the confrontation between British and Germans on this occasion.
and as no one imagines a kind of collective mirage of the pilots of three squadrons, it is that undoubtedly, and in spite of much research, we have not yet identified the German squadron which intervened, and which (or did not) suffer any loss.

I thank you for your intervention Stig, I think like you that it is essential to ask all the questions

frédéric