7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

This squadron made at least 12 kills in eleven days 16-27 September, defending Kos. Does anyone have exact details of their claims? My information is as follows:

16.09.43 1-0-0 Ju88
17.09.43 1-0-0 Ju52
18.09.43 3-1-0 Ju88, 2-0-0 Bf109
19.09.43 1-0-0 Bf109, 0-0-1 Ju88
20.09.43 1-0-0 Bf109
26.09.43 1-0-0 Ju88
27.09.43 1-0-2 Ju88, 1-0-0 Bf109

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi Kieth

I had a look at the 7 SAAF Sqn ORB at Kew some time ago but I can not remember if it was because it was unreadable or that they had lost some of there records and that was why I never got photo copies of it. I will look again when I next visit Kew, have you looked through TOE by C.Shores ?
This may be of some help I think that IV/JG27 were in combat over Kos on the 18th and 19th of Sep 43 as they claimed five Spitfires and lost three 109's. Will contact you in the New Year.

Cheers

David

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi,

here the losses of Bf109:
18.09.43

10/JG27 Bf109G-2 W.Nr.10463 white 1+= Ofw.W.Morgenstern MIA Kos
10/JG27 Bf109G-6 W.Nr.18470 white 5+= Uffz.Gustav Dettmar POW Kos

19.09.43

11/JG27 Bf109G-6 W.Nr.20335 red 7+= Uffz.Walter Torge MIA Kos

27.09.43

IV/JG27 Bf109G-6 W.Nr.15975 lost in air combat over Rhodos

Perhaps someone could help me with Spitfire and Boston losses over Kos:

18.09.43 - 3 Spitfires between 15.08-15.13 N and NW Kos
19.09.43 - 2 Spitfires around 08.17 WSW Kos
30.09.43 - 1 Walrus 14.40 Leros
01.10.43 - 2 Boston ? NW Kos

Regards

Robert

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi,

I have this 7 SAAF losses:

18.9.43 N of Kos lieutenants Turner (JK148) and Cheesman(JK140) in combat with Bf109
19.9.43 Kos lieutnant Seel in combat with Bf109
27.9.43 Kos lt Prescott and Hynd around 11,30; lt Basson bailed out in the afternoon raid, all in combat with Bf109


and this german claims:
18.8.43 3 spitfire (2 fw Keller and 1 FjUff Hientzsch) N of Kos 15,08-15,13
19.9.43 2 spitfire (lt Hetzler, oblt Boesler) WSW Kos 8.17
27.9.43 2 spitfire (uffz Loeffler and ofw Gromotka) Kos 11,18-11,20
2 spitfire (ofw Gromotka and ofw Scheit) Kos 15,17-15,20

alessandro

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Grazie Alessandro!

Robert

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi guys

Regarding claims, this is what I have:

16/9/43
Lts EM Taylor & AEF Cheesman Ju88 2(F)/123 4U+RK

17/9/43
Lt RP Burl Ju52

18/9/43
Lts RP Burl & DR Fisher Ju88 Probably recce aircraft
Lt AA Ground Ju88
Lt OJ Kelly Ju88
Lt PP van Deventer Ju88 - possibly all three attacked Ju88 II/ZG26, which FTR
Capt HE Kirby Bf109
Lt EM Taylor Bf109

Ofw Morgenstein & Uffz Dettmar IV/JG27 FTR
Lts AG Turner & Cheesman both KiA

19/9/43
Lt IM Seel Bf109 but then spun in (shot down?) and killed
Lts KW Prescott & JH Hynd Bf109
Lt RP Burl Ju88 damaged

20/9/43
Lt Inggs Ju88 II/KG6 3E+GM

27/9/43
Maj CA van Vliet Bf109
Lt AL Basson Bf109 then shot down (rescued)
Lts AA Ground and DR Fisher Ju88 plus two Ju88s damaged (apparently Ju88 crew rescued by Z506B)

Lts Prescott & Hynd both shot down and killed

28/9/43
Lt DS Jaeger Bf109

Capt EA Rorvik KiA
Lt EM Taylor shot down (rescued)

I am sure we would all appreciate any additions to the above; serial numbers would be useful as would Lt Inggs' first name/initials (unknown to me).

Hope this helps.

Brian

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Thanks chaps, my info was from the War in the Aegean and the SAAF Officila history. I believe 7 Squadron scored on two occassions in addition to this.

12/02/43 1-0-0 Ju88 Lt Fisher, Rorvik and 2/Lt Rosholt
17/04/44 0-0-1 Bf109 Lt Richter.

From this information it looks like Capt. RP Burl should be in TOE with these claims in addition to another with 41 Sqn SAAF in 1944.

I have read that Van Vliet was a high scoring pilot but until now his only previous service I have located was flying Fairey Battles in East Africa with 11 Sqn SAAF, then with 1 Sqn SAAF in Libya in 1941. where he claimed a Bf109 on 17/12/41. Another candidate for TOE?

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi Keith.
What is the TOE???
Stefaan

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Stefaan,

TOE is Those Other Eagles, by Christopher Shores (Grub Street, 2004).

van Vliet appears in Aces High (Shores & Williams), with four victories listed, and an explanation of the supposed "high score" in East Africa.

It would appear that Burl, Taylor and Ground should all be in TOE.

Frank.

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Happy New Year including Frank!!

It seems as though Fisher also qualifies for inclusion in TOE - three shared Ju88s plus one damaged?

Cheers
Brian

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Crikey! Looks like we are on the way to TOE Volume 2!

I also have Haslope of 165 Sqn scoring kills over a Ju88 (shared with FO Eva) in 1944 and a solo victory over an Me163 in 1945 so...

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi Frank
Never seen that down here in S Africa.
Going to order it asap.
What is his criteria to become an Eagle??
I'll see if I can get info on Van Vliet
Be good from sunny S Africa

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi Frank
I found this site on the life of Van vliet.
It is the net version of the SA military His journal.
http://www.rapidttp.co.za/milhist/index.html
It does not give the kills but it may help
Stefaan

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi
I found this list of S African aces.Note some of them flew in the RAF.
THE SOUTH AFRICAN ACES NameScoreKnown asSquadronsM.T.St.J.Pattle, DFC and bar41"Tom"80 and 33 RAFA.G. Malan, DSO and bar, DFC and bar35''Sailor"74 RAFJ.J. Le Roux,DFC and two bars23.5"Chris"73, 91, 111, 602 RAFP.H. Hugo, DSO, DFC and two bars22"Dutch"615 and 41 RAFJ.E.Frost, DFC and bar15"John"3 and 5 SAAFM.S. Osler, DFC and bar12 "Benny"145 and 601 RAF, 1 SAAFC.A. van Vliet, DFC12"Kees"1, 4 and 7 SAAFK.W. Driver, DFC12"Ken"1 SAAFA.C. Bosman, DSO, DFC10.5"Andy"72 RAF, 1, 2 and 4 SAAFDavis, DFC10,5"Carl"601 RAFE.J. Morris, DSO10"Ted"79, 238 and 250 RAFR.H. Talbot10"Bob"274 RAF and 1 SAAFS.F.B. Theron, DSO, DFC10"Servaas"250 RAF and 3 SAAFD.W. Golding, DFC9"Doug"4 SAAFH.P. Lardner-Burke, DFC and bar8.5"Henry"1, 19, 46, 126 and 222 RAFE.C. Saville, DFC and bar8"Eric"112 and 260 RAF; 2 and 5 SAAFT.Y. Wallace, DFM8"Tom"111 and 610 RAFB. van Mentz, DFC7.5"Brian"222 and 504 RAFA.C. Rabagliati, DFC and bar7"Alex"46 and 126 RAFB.G. Stapleton, DFC 6.5"Hugh"32, 247, 257 and 603 RAFH. Starrett6.5"Harry"33 RAFG.D.L. Haysom, DSO, DFC6"David"79 RAFJ.R.A. Bailey, DFC6.5"Jim"85, 125, 264 and 600 RAFD.V.D. Lacey, DFC6"Dennis"2 and 5 SAAFG.J. Le Mesurier, DFC6"Lemmie"1 SAAFR. Pare, DFC6"Robin"1 and 5 SAAFL.R.S. Waugh, DFC6"Laurie"417 and 601 RAF, 1 SAAFB.J.C. Boyle, DFC5.5"John"1 SAAFA. Duncan, DFC5.5"Dunk"1 and 5 SAAFJ.M. Faure, DSO, DFC and bar5.5"Johannes"92 RAF, 1 and 4 SAAFJ.H. Gaynor, DFC5.5"John"1, 2 and 7 SAAFMcC.E.S. Robinson, DFC5.5"Mac"1 SAAFM.C.H. Barber, DFC5"Maurice"250 and 450 RAFA.J. Botha5"Boet"1 SAAFL.C. Botha, DFC5"Louis"5 SAAFR.J.P. Collingwood, DFC5"Moon"82 and 152 RAF, 1 SAAFJ.L. Hewitson, DFC5"John"1, 4 and 5 SAAFJ.D.W. Human, DSO, DFC and bar5"John" 1, 2 and 5 SAAFV.M.L. Lindsay, DFC5"Vernon"2 SAAFP.C.R. Metelerkamp5"Pete"1 SAAFD.G. Morris, DSO, DFC5"Zulu"406 RCAF(Scores given correct to the nearest 0.5)
Hope it helps
Stefaan

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Here's a link to another list of South African Aces

http://server-mat.fce.vutbr.cz/safar...s1/sa-ww2.html

Criteria for inclusion in Those Other Eagles is less than five destruction claims but more than one.

Best Regards

Andy Fletcher

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Hi,

now I`m able to partly respond to my question:

30.09.43 a Walrus piloted by F/Lt. FEG Rashleigh with navigator Sgt Clifford Platt also on board had the great misfortune to be caught and shot down by marauding Bf109s from III/JG27.
My question is if somebody could give me the unit, to which this Walrus had belonged?

Robert

Re: 7 Squadron SAAF, Kos 1943
 

Brian,

I don't have the first name of Lt. Inngs, but his nickname was "Pitch". This I get from a newspaper article about the squadron's effort on Kos, which was published in the Cape Argus newspaper in 1977:


Harry
Vancouver
CANADA