Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Guys:

I recall from reading something as a child (we're talking probably OVER 35 years ago) a couple of unusual events that took place:

A in a badly battered bomb group one of the crewmen was reading a magazine & came across a propaganda ad, showing a smiling, confident air gunner blazing away merrily at a swarm of German fighters with the quote on the ad:
'So, who's afraid of the Big Bad Wulf(as in Focke Wulf, of course)"; he was so upset by this he tore off the ad & took it around his group and EVERY flying member signed a note saying, in big bold capital letters:
"WE ARE!!"
and they sent it back to the magazine company;

Another:

New gunner in a 'heavy'; his first time in combat he see German fighters closing on them & he calls out something like 'fighters coming in fast!'--rather excitedly of course & he forgets to use the 'clock position' giving the direction they're coming from; the pilot asks, "what time?" & the gunner replies "NOW!!"

SO....does anyone know the 'source' of these stories? It's definitely not part of my more modern reading material & I never found it in any of books by Roger Freeman;

TIA

NickM

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Interesting ... I too remember reading that first story back in my school days in the 60s. I checked the books I have from then but couldn't find it any of them. I'll check around some more and let you know what I find ...

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Do you think it might be from an author whom I haven't touched in over 30 years: Martin Caidin?

NickM

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Funny, he is one I was going to check - there is an old copy of "Black Thursday" (which I read in high school) at my mom's house that I am going to look at today. I also read a book called "Air War Against Hitler's Germany" back then, and I'm going to check that too.

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Some may have also come from Caidin's book, "Flying Fortress". Although many of us cut our teeth on his early works, he is now pretty thoroughly discredited. Too bad, because as a writer, he was good: just a lousy researcher and placed good stories over truth for the sake of selling books.

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

I wasn't able to see the books today, but plan to next weekend - I'll let you know if I find anything. I read Caidin's Flying Forts about 10 years ago, but I recall the Big Bad Wulf story from my youth; I'll scan through FF to see if he mentioned it there too.

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

My first view of the "WHo's afraid of the Focke Wulf" anecdote was in Tex McCRary's "First of the Many" Simon Schuster 1944 - the book I cut my 8th AF teeth on at the age of 7.

To those who haven't read it, do so - it's simply the best capture of 8th AF in the early days when the daylight battle outcome was still 'uncertain'.

It also has the Gale Cleven 100BG story on the first Shuttle Mission with the famous quote to his co-pilot when they were shot to pieces but not on fire - and the co pilot wanted to bail out.. "I'm sticking, see, and you $oB, you're sticking too!" as he was poking him the chest..

So many great stories about the 'Belle", etc and many individual human interest short stories that captured all the gritty details of guys who lived in fear of their last day on eatth - but climbed into that B-17 (and 24) anyway..

Regards,

Bill Marshall

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

True or not these stories are funny and emphasize the atmosphere of the days. After all, they might have happened.

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

I was finally able to track down one version of the “Big Bad Wulf” story: Martin Caidin’s Black Thursday, copyright 1960, Ballantine Books paperback edition, (cover painting shows a wounded crewmember being carried away from a B-17 on a stretcher; weird pumpkin-color sky background), no source cited; pp 76 - 77:

“During the height of the period of disastrous missions over the Reich, an American aircraft firm, following the policy that Americans are better than anybody else, sponsored probably the most ill-received advertisement of the war. The advertisement was full page, and it showed a grinning gunner peering through the sights of a .50-caliber machine gun as he poured tracers into a swarm of Focke-Wulf FW-190 fighters. Beneath the heroic painting was the caption: 'Who’s Afraid of the Big Bad Wulf?'

One pilot who saw the page immediately tore it from the magazine and pinned it to his group’s bulletin board. Beneath the page went a long scroll of paper with a red-ink headline that shouted: “WE ARE!”

Every combat officer in the group signed the scroll, and the group commander’s name was at the top of the list. They mailed it to the manufacturer with their blessings.”

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Ah...so it WAS Martin Caidin...I'd sworn him off decades ago...no wonder I never saw that quote again!

NickM

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Nick - the quote and incident of signing was real Re "Who's afraid of the Fock Wulf"

Tex McCrary wrote about it in First of the Many published in 1944. He didn't name the group because of wartime censorship but he spent a lot of time around the 91st, 94th, the 305th and 100th BG so the probabbility is high(er) that he picked it up in one of those groups.. it preceeded Caiden by a looooooong time.

If you have not read this one - I HIGHLY recommend it as a penetrating insight/human interest stories about the 8th in the early to late 1943 timeframe

Regards,

Bill

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Interesting! If really true, I wonder who created the ad?
Walt

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

For sure...normally though, I don't read stuff written during the war (I've done so in past & have a hard time wading through the wartime propaganda of the time---)but still the immediacy & emotions are important to the overall 'picture' of the war; I'll try to find this

NickM

Re: Source of some 'apocryphal' 8th AF stories..
 

Nick - there is always a little bit of 'that' but I thought McCrary did a great job of cpaturing the grit, the sense of loss when a popular crew went down, the 'race' between Hell's Angels, the Memphis Belle and Knockout Dropper to be the first 25, then later the first to reach 50.

Another one is Target;Germany. One of the major pieces contained here is a collage of nose art (B/W) of the more colorful B-17's and B-24's in 8th AF inside front and back cover.

I'm not sure I have read any books better at capturing the conditions, the drabness of winter/fall weather, the tension and the stories of USAAF ops in 1943 - dominantly B-17 and B-24 crews, London, some fighters... but you will find the 'apocryphal 8th AF' stories - leaves no question it was a tough war for 8th AF.

Regards,

Bill