Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum

Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/index.php)
-   Luftwaffe and Axis Air Forces (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/forumdisplay.php?f=8)
-   -   Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43 (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=60356)

gilles collaveri 20th July 2021 07:22

Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
Dear all,

on 21 June 1943 JU88 Wr 885823 collides with a high voltage power line and crashes in a field.
This occurred 3 km SW of Toulouse, South West of France.
Any information on the background of this accident ?

Three crew members are killed (Ernst Kappes, Hans Palm & Werner Kratzyn: KIA) and surprisingly, the pilot (Wolgang Skorczewski) survives.
I am astonished that on a JU88 crash, the pilot is alive while the rest of the crew is killed,
what is your opinion on this ?

TIA

GC

Chris Goss 20th July 2021 08:11

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
Gilles-survival could be affected by many factors such were they strapped in or not, where they were located when the collision occurred etc. Plane must have been at low level so time between collision & crash landing must have been short. Remember also the pilot has a better seat-friend of mine was a Ju 188 pilot and shot down in October 1943. When attacked by a Mosquito he made sure he was hunched up in the seat and heard his 3 crew being hit behind him. He was the only survivor and without a scratch

Chris Goss 22nd July 2021 14:47

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
Just checked the 1976 KG 76 Association list and the survivor is not listed

Jim P. 22nd July 2021 16:52

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
In Jochen Kaiser's "Die Ritterkreuzträger der Kampfflieger, V.2", p.120-21, the bio for Skorczewski makes no mention at all of this incident, only the acknowledgement that he was the Stkp. of 11./KG 76. There are details from a couple of other incidents from his time with KG 27 though.

Chris Goss 22nd July 2021 17:55

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
So a Hptm at the time of this incident. Interesting that he also passed away in NZ

Karsten 21st January 2022 12:29

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
I have Informations as Follow:
Skorcezewsky Wolfgang Hptm. verl.
Kappes Ernst Uffz. 11.05.1920 tot
Palm Hans Ogfr. 08.03.1920 tot
Kratzin Werner Fw. 19.10.1916 tot
IV./ KG 76

Regards Rüdiger

Adriano Baumgartner 21st January 2022 23:40

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
Gilles, just a suggestion, but it would be interesting to discover how the accident ocurred?
Did the top rudder collided with the power lines? Was it the horizontal stabilizer? Was it one of the wingtips (if so they rotated and lost energy when one of the wings hit the terrain first)?

We did have recently (just before Xmas) in Brazil a civilian accident (C-90 King Air) which collided with power lines and the airplane just lost power and almost dived into the ground vertically, without forward energy. It was most weird, but the fuselage broke in two or more places, without props being bent backwards. So, like Chris put with propriety, it all depends of how it ocurred. I do not know if Luftwaffe crash reports have survived WW2...I doubt.

MAYBE, the pilot may have written to his Family or wife about this incident, who knows? Maybe a letter exist somewhere (or not) which can give us a clue about this accident.

I have seen WW2 letters where such kind of incidents are related softly, but with some interesting details (KG 27). So, perhaps if the relatives of the pilot are still alive in NZ, you may be able to check or verify with them if such a letter or Flugbuch entry does exist (it is however a very very "sniper" long super long shot!). You may be lucky, or not.

Semper Fi.
Adriano

Chris Goss 22nd January 2022 08:39

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
I believe Gilles has written up this incident for a French magazine so assume his research is finished?

gilles collaveri 24th January 2022 07:58

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
Hi all,

Adriano : salut mon pote, and yes, I fully agree with your comments. I would love to find a report of that crash : Luftwaffe report, a letter from the pilot but how get it ? So far, I have only testimonies from very old people stating that the aircraft hit a power line, then smoke appeared and it crashed.

I noted that the pilot Wolfgang Skorcezewsky died on 30 Nov. 2005 in Auckland New Zealand (info: "P.Bastin") , so, it is possible that he left some memories, pictures, writings. Would any reader in NZ help us find his family or relatives ?
[/b][/u]

Chris : I did not write or publish anything so far because I did not find any part yet. I have a rough idea of the crash place but this is thousand of square meters, we have only vague testimonies indicating the area, and these are vast fields. So, we have to investigate and search on this the zone, it will take some time, it is really a huge area to explore .

Thanks Rüdiger. The crew composition is clear now. So, the pilot survived and the other crew members were killed. Strange but can be explained as in the previous posts.

Thanks merci Danke Schön all for your support.

Gilles

RT 24th January 2022 12:47

Re: Crash of JU88 Wnr885823 of KG76 on 21/6/43
 
Salut, Gilles,
Place for the accident is given as 3 km SW Cintegabelle Plaine Mailhol, so a bit more farther from Toulouse, possible cue is to ask if last french premier, Jospin, has some light to shed on the accident :D


Rémi


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 13:48.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.2
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright ©2004 - 2018, 12oclockhigh.net