Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

If anyone had any information or lists of German pilots who were successful against the Mosquito, I would really appreciate it. Welter's Mosquito and "Wilde Sau" claims are of course controversial, but I was curious as to whether or not there were other German day and especially night fighter pilots who had success against the Mosquito. Thank you.

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

I have the following German pilots claiming 3 claims or more against Mosquitoes:

Oblt Kurt Welter (JG 300, NJG 11) 37
Fw Reichenbach (JG 300, NJG 11) 8
Fw Karl-Heinz Becker (NJG 11) 6
Hptm Heinz Strüning (NJG 1) 3
Ofw Adolf Glunz (JG 26) 3
Lt Joachim Weber (Epr. Kdo 262) 3

Source; Luftwaffe claims list by Tony Wood and Jim Perry

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Hello Krichter33,

I would recommend "A history of the German Night Fighter Force 1917-1945" by Bernd Barbas, which HAVE a full Luftwaffe's night fighter claims against the Mosquito.

I do read somewhere, that an American writer was writting about the failure of the LW night-fighter squadrons, in intercepting the fast and versatile Mosquitos, particularly at night.

Also read somewhere, that some of the Mosquito claims submitted by KURT WELTER were controversial. He is a most fascinating subject, and I really do wish someone will manage to write a full biography with access to his Logbooks, etc...

All the best.

Adriano Baumgartner

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Hello ,

Here some Mosquito losses over Belgium :
/07/1942
Tourinnes-la-Grosse
Mosquito IV
DK-322
F w Roden Erwin 12./JG1
105Sqn
GB-P
Sgt Pickett K.C. (POW - Bailed out) 1168696 344-27176
Sgt Evans Herbert.E. (KIA) observer 943155
Sgt Evans buried Heverlee Belgium

11/04/1943
Destelbergen
Mosquito IV
Flak+
139Sqn
XD-N
Marham
F/OBrown John H J/8793 piloot RCAF (KIA) 26 jaar Windsor Ontario F/O Pounder George 119902 navigator (KIA)

16/04/1943
Vlimmeren
Mosquito IV
Fw-190 Fw Hütter Georg 6./JG1 12H28
Special Task "Pampa"
DZ-406
1409 Flight
NO-K
P/O Griffiths George G (KIA) pilot 140916
Sgt Brown Roland (KIA) 1059977 - navigator
Schoonselhof cemetery Antwerpen

21/04/1944 Tourinnes-St-Lambert
Mosquito DD-616
Hptm Paul Zörner / Ofw Wilke Heinrich Stab III ./NJG5
169 Sqn
F/L Morgan Gordon E ( EVD ) pilot

2/05/1944
Zaventem Mosquito VI I
Intruder operatie Bonn
MM-409
305Sqn
SM-
F/O Archer Raymond L piloot 124689 (KIA) F/L McEwan Arthur M navigator 78083(KIA) 34 year ,

Regards

Alain57

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Adriano

Surely you mean the book by Gebhard Aders?
As far as I know Barbas has not published anything about night fighters

Cheers
Stig

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

well there weren't many - I take it you haven't looked at Lorant/Goyat's two volume history of JG 300; a number of pilots with Mosquito claims therein eg Mitterdorfer, Cypionka (10./JG 300) etc ...then of course the pilots who went on to fly with NJG 11 etc (see Laurent's post above) . Ultimately not even the specialist Moskito hunting units could shoot them down, eg Neptun-equipped Fw 190s of NJGr.10.

By way of example and to quote just one month, Bomber Command mounted seven night raids over Berlin during June 1944, dispatching some thirty Mosquitoes on each mission - just five of these failed to return (NJG 1 four claims IIRC, see Laurent's post above)

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

yes you read correctly Adriano about two American authors ...........

keep the patience flowing. no matter what NJG 11 could do with their Fw 190's and later souped up 109G-6/AS and G-14/AS radar or not their claims were very minimal. As Neil spoke truly the 10th staffel (Nacht) of JG 300 was the most prolific in interception and downings for their very short career until amking up the new II./NJG 11.

10./NJG 11 was beset by all sorts of movement and political problems besides some unusual and definitive personalites within it's pilot ranks.

E ~

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

STIG: You are totally right! I put the correct tittle on the name of Barbas, instead of Gebhard Aders ( really a mess of my part! Sorry, if both are reading! ). However, there is a very interesting list of the LW night claims against the Mosquito ( very few indeed ) on the useful mentioned book.

FALKE EINS: Yes, I forgot to mention the excellent work done by J-Y Lorant/Goyat on his two volumes of the JG 300 History. Several claims with interview from German pilots, etc..some claims are cross-checked, etc. An amazing work ( 25 years of research! ). A "must" for all those interested on Aeronautical History.

ERICH: From the previous posts here and at LEMB, I have a guess that you are one of those two American writers, which, as I read here and there on some posts, do have such a vast knowledge about the Nachtjagd! Firstly: congratulations! Secondly: We are really waiting this major work of yours, on the Mosquito hunters. As a former Mosquito Aircrew Association Member ( civilian ), it would be mervellous to read those airmen accounts of positive or negative ( evasive action ) interceptions by the Luftwaffe side. Do hope you managed to contact former Mosquito airmen as well as NJG11, NJGr10, NJG 1, NJG 3, JGr 50 veterans and LW airmen from other Specialized Kommandos, which tried to intercept and interrupt the easy going life of the Mosquito airmen over the III Reich. All the best and we will be waiting for the books! ( By the way: any He 219 veterans interviewed? ).

Adriano Baumgartner

PS: There were one or two JG400 claims also, against the Mosquito, mainly in 1945; if memory does not fail me. One of them, 100% certain it was either a 540 or a 544 machine.

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

I believe, when it all shakes out, Becker will have been the most successful.

Clearly though, I need to track down the JG 300 volumes.

Adriano, the March claim by JG 400 is for a PR Mossie which can be shown to have gotten away, and I've not been able to match the April claim to a loss.

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Thank you all for the great information!

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Gentlemen: May I suggest you talk with Jorge Czypionka to discuss Mosquito victories at night. He attends our Camarillo Annual Air Show if able and tells me he downed two Mosquitos and one Typhoon while flying the Me-262 as a night fighter. Would you like me to contact him and determine if he is willing to discuss this with you?
Cordially, Art Fiedler

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

As a side note, Major Yasuhiko Kuroe from the JAAF's 64th Sentai claimed two Mosquitos while flying the Ki.43.
Nov. 2, 1943, 1 Mosquito (P/O Fielding, 684 Sqn.)
Dec. 10, 1943, 1 Mosquito (P/O Cotton, 684 Sqn.)

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Hey Art

actually Georg shot down the Typhoon flying a day camo'd Me 262A-1a. an interesting story it was too. His missions will be covered in our book

best

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

I believe there was a claim made by a pilot of JG 5 that occurred during a daylight raid over Norway. I need to check sources unless someone can help out.

Chuck

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Uffz Rudolf Fenten of 6/JG 5 claimed a Mosquito in Sept 1942. The aircraft was shotdown near Oslo.

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Hi,

I started researching this, and got a little carried away. Please find attached all of the victory claims for Mosquitos that I could find (courtesy of Russell Guest’s victory claims list). There was a total of at least 218 claims, made up of:
- 1 in 1941
- 21 in 1942
- 42 in 1943
- 97 in 1944
- 57 in 1945

Leading overall scorers against the Mosquito were:

37: Kurt Welter, 10./J.G. 300, II./N.J.G. 11
8: Klaus Reichenbach, 10./J.G. 300, II./N.J.G. 11
6: Karl-Heinz Becker, II./N.J.G. 11
4: Heinz Käppler, 14./J.G. 5, 15./J.G. 5
3: Adolf Glunz, 4./J.G. 26, 5./J.G. 26
Heinz Strüning, 2./N.J.G. 1, 3./N.J.G. 1
Joachim Weber, Erpro. Kdo. 262
2: Günther Allmenröder, 3./J.G. 1
Walter Baltruschat, 10./J.G. 300
Karl Bugaj, 11./J.G. 1
Rudolf Fenten, 1./J.G. 77, 2./J.G. 5
Rolf Glogner, 2./J.G. 400
Knud Gmelin, 1./Z.G. 1
Ernst-Ewald Hittler, 3./N.J.G. 1
Georg Hutter, 5./J.G. 1
Max Kolschek, 6./J.G. 1, 4./J.G. 1
Friedrich May, 8./J.G. 2
Karl Mitterdorfer, 10./J.G. 300
Josef Nabrich, 3./N.J.G. 1
Rauer, 3./N.J.G. 1
Robert Spreckels, A.St. J.G. 11


Leading scorers for claims included in the victory claims microfilms were:

10: Kurt Welter, 10./J.G. 300, II./N.J.G. 11
3: Adolf Glunz, 4./J.G. 26, 5./J.G. 26
Heinz Strüning, 2./N.J.G. 1, 3./N.J.G. 1
2: Walter Baltruschat, 10./J.G. 300
Knud Gmelin, 1./Z.G. 1
Ernst-Ewald Hittler, 3./N.J.G. 1
Friedrich May, 8./J.G. 2
Karl Mitterdorfer, 10./J.G. 300
Josef Nabrich, 3./N.J.G. 1
Rauer, 3./N.J.G. 1
Klaus Reichenbach, 10./J.G. 300, II./N.J.G. 11
Robert Spreckels, A.St. J.G. 11


Broken down by theatre:
West & Norway: 215
Mediterranean: 2
Rumania: 1


Night versus day claims (not sure of exact times for some claims):
Night: 105
Day: 113


Not sure how many of these claims can be matched to actual losses – I’ll leave that bit of research to someone else.


Cheers,
Andrew A.

Air War Publications – www.airwarpublications.com

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Thanks for all the great information Andrew. That was exactly what I was looking for. I also appreciate the research you've done on the Mosquito claims actually confirmed. Great work!

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Andrew - check PMs.

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Hello One & All,

regarding Welter, I think it is time to stop repeating the myths over and over and over....

I see references made above to the tallies in the lists of some respected researchers and posters on this board, but I would contend that in compiling their lists they have sourced information from some less than reputable sources (i.e. such as the Nonnenmacher Nachtjagd claims lists).

According to the transcripts of the claims microfilms, Welter claimed 10 Mosquitoes between 26 Aug - 28 Oct 1944. Of these 10 claims, according to the transcripts, eight were acknowledged and two were still awaiting acknowledgement.

According to Welter's Wehrpass, between 2 Nov 44 - end of Feb 45 he made a further 15 claims (two of which were reputedly Lancasters), and from March until the end of the war, a further 8 claims.

Thus, from these two fragmentary documentary sources:

10 Mosquitoes (8 of which confirmed) 8-10/44
13 believed Mosquitoes 11/44-2/45
8 believed Mosquitoes 3/45-5/45
__
31 possible Mosquito claims

In looking at these claims, the 13 believed Mosquitoes claimed between 11/44-2/45 inclusive are very difficult to verify in terms of the date of the claim and the actual e/c type claimed.

Then there is Welter's often quoted post-war memo of 29/5/1945, which is in contradiction with itself and the claims microfilms/Wehrpass. The first part of Welter's memo breaks down his flying and Mosquito claims by type flown and date, while the second part of the memo provides a break-down by enemy type of his claims.

(1st part of memo) - 7 Mosquitoes in Bf109 between 8-9/44, 3 Mosquitoes (night) in Me262 between 9/44-1/45, 22 Mosquitoes (20 night, 2 day) in Me262 between 1-4/45 = 32 Mosquito claims.

(2nd part of Memo) - 1 Mosquito (day) in Bf109, 2 Mosquitoes (day) in Me262, 20 Mosquitoes (night) in Me262 = 23 Mosquito claims.

Cheers

Rod

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

just to add to Rod's posting in all probability due to the brief reasons I gave on an earlier posting on page # 1, Kurt W. did not fly a 262A-1a in March onward. The idea that twin seater Röte 10 was his is also falsified as well.

Re: Successful pilots against the Mosquito
 

Hi Erich,

thanks for the additional info.


From what I can gather from documentary sources, of the 8 claims listed in Welter's Wehrpass from March '45 onwards, 2 certain and one probable Mosquito Abschüsse were claimed by Welter on the night of 2-3 March 1945, and two certain Abschüsse were claimed by Welter on the night of 21-22 March 1945. In the latter case, an OKL Lw.FüSt Ic Luftlagemeldung states that 2 Me262 sorties were flown and three Mosquito Abschüsse claimed. An Abschussmeldung proves that K-H Becker flew one of the two sorties and made one claim. The same Abschussmeldung has a witness statement by Welter which indicates that he was airborne, thus it can be reasonably assumed that Welter flew the second sortie and claimed the other two Abschüsse.


In a post-war interrogation by the British, Welter claimed to have damaged one Mosquito and shot down another on the night of 3-4 April 1945. As the damaged Mosquito was actually attacked and claimed as destroyed by Lt. Altner (as verified by the Abschussmeldung and corresponding RAF Combat Report), Welter's testimony should be treated with suspicion.

While this gets outside the terms of the information originally requested in this thread, I believe that it goes towards showing that much more critical research is needed about the claims of Welter to seperate what can be established via documentary sources from some of the rubbish that has been published and over the years. And, due to the use of the Nonnenmacher claims list, I've been responsible for the publication of some of this 'rubbish'.


Cheers

Rod