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-   -   Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943 (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=26456)

rickback4444 24th July 2011 21:13

Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hi,

Can anyone provide details over the loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler who was killed on the 24th November 1943?

He was a fighter pilot but with what unit and which theatre did he die in?

Many thanks

Rick

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/$(KGrHqQOKjQ...1myw~~0_12.JPG

G.R.Morrison 24th July 2011 21:44

Re: loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler
 
Bf 109F-4 WNr. 5503 of JGr.Süd, Uffz. Lorenz Schäffler killed in crash 24.Nov. 1943 near Nimes (non-combat flight).

Hope this clarifies, GRM

ouidjat 29th July 2011 10:40

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hi,

Got some extra: "Gelbe 3" in 3./JGr. Süd...
Note that the same plane was involved in two other accident in the same unit.
28/6/1943 as "Rote 22" near Salon, 20%.
13/7/1943; Fl.Pl. Nimes 30%.

Tschüss, Franck.

rickback4444 29th July 2011 18:26

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hi,

Was JGr.Süd operational and were they engaged in combat or training unit?

Rick

DB601E 1st August 2011 09:33

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hi Rick,

this is what i have:

Loss information
Schäffler, Lorenz, Unteroffizier, Flugzeugführer, 3./JGr.Süd
Verluste der ErgJGr.Süd / JGr.Süd nach Akte RL 2 III / 1195, Seite 24, lfd. Nr. 14
Luftflotte 3:
24.11.1943, 3./JGr.Süd bei Nimes Absturz, Aufschlagbrand.
Bf 109 F-4, WNr. 5503 (gelbe 4), Bruch 100%.
Flugzeugführer: Unteroffizier Schäffler, Lorenz, .

Grave Information:
Schäffler, Lorenz, Unteroffizier, * 13.07.1921 - 24.11.1943.
Er ruht auf der Kriegsgräberstätte in Dagneux (F),
Endgrablage: Block 17, Grab 504.

We did some research about this unit for years, this is a small summary:
The Jagdgruppe Süd was a so called "Ergänzungsgruppe", after finishing the flight formation, young fighter pilotes have been transfered to this unit to get in touch with combat tactics and first combat missions. The length of stay in this unit was between some weeks and 3 month. The instructors have been mostly experienced fighter pilots, "borrowed" also short time from their units. The Jagruppe Süd was temporarily responsible for training pilots of JG 3, JG 27 and JG 53. In the sametime this unit, operating from several airfields in southern france, was responsible to protect the whole area of the mediterranean french coast. There was also a group of experienced pilots assigned to a "Einsatzkommando", to provide fast reaction against incoming allied aircraft. This unit had a lot of losses and it's been mostly the young and unexperienced pilots that did not survive their first missions. In june 1944 the units name was changed to Jagdgruppe 200.
More information about the unit and pilots you will find on my webpage http://www.u-air.info/www/uair/uair....chive?OpenForm and on the website of Nick Beale concerning Jagdgruppe 200: http://www.ghostbombers.com/

Regards

Lino

If you agree, i'd like to include this picture to my collection about Jagdgruppe Sud pilots. If you like to have more information about this unit, please let me know.

rickback4444 1st August 2011 20:48

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hi Lino,

No problem. Thanks for the detailed information

Rick

JohnnyB 2nd August 2011 00:35

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DB601E (Post 132142)
(...)

We did some research about this unit for years, this is a small summary:
The Jagdgruppe Süd was a so called "Ergänzungsgruppe", after finishing the flight formation, young fighter pilotes have been transfered to this unit to get in touch with combat tactics and first combat missions.
(...)

Hi Lino,

I want add a question to you please.
Did you have also informations about "Ergänzungsgruppe West", what it was exactly and where it was in February 1943 ? My father was there for a short time (Ergänzungsgruppe West/10.2.43-15.3.43), then he joined to the 1./JG26.

Many thanks,

Rainer

Andreas Brekken 2nd August 2011 09:11

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hi.

Same type of unit as Jagdgr.Süd. Best allied equivalent is an OTU, operational training unit, last stage in education before frontline service.

The Jagdgruppe West was dispersed on various airfields in southern France, from the atlantic coast to the mediterrenean coast, airfields like Merignane, Dax, Mont de Marsan, Cazaux and others.

Regards,
Andreas B

Charles Bavarois 2nd August 2011 11:58

Re: Information concerning the Loss of Uffz. Lorenz Schaffler - 24.11.1943
 
Hello guys,

just a short addition:

Uffz Lorenz Schäffler was lost during a gunnery-training-flight at "Luftschießplatz Nimes" (air-shooting-range Nimes) at 16:10 hrs.

His dog-tags were issued at Flieger-Ausbildungsregiment 23, so he probably had had his basic military training at this unit.

Regards

Carl


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