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-   -   The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring (http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=62352)

knusel 30th July 2022 22:29

The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Good evening Gentlemen,

I believe that the Mikoyan-Gurevich scored kills over a longer period than any other plane in history.
The earliest shootdown that I know of (drones excluded) was when the Vietnamese claimed an F-105D on 7Jun1966.
The latest shootdown that I know of was when on 27Feb2019 a Pakistani Air Force F-16 fighter jet was shot down by Indian air defence forces in Rajouri sector of Jammu region.
A period of 52 years, 8 months and 20 days. It's virtually impossible that any plane has superseded that record.
Unfortunately, I don't know the names of the pilots who claimed those two shootdowns. Does anybody of you ?

Cheers,

Michael

Franek Grabowski 2nd August 2022 16:22

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
The last kill is by Group Captain Abhinandan Varthaman but this seems bogus. The information appeared quite a while after the shot down of Varthaman who was captured, and no convincing evidence has been ever produced. For me it looks like a propaganda action.

knusel 2nd August 2022 23:17

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Good evening Franek,

thanks for the name which is a good starting point for me to investigate the matter further. You're right: a modern F-16 shot down by a vintage jet seems hard to believe.

What do you think about the 10 August 1999, when a Pakistan Breguet Atlantic was shot down by two Indian Air Force MiG-21's ?

Cheers,

Michael

Stig Jarlevik 3rd August 2022 00:31

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Franek

While beyond my real interest you say the last claim was by G/C Varthaman.
In the next sentence you indicate Varthaman was the one shot down and captured.

Which way is it?

Cheers
Stig

Franek Grabowski 3rd August 2022 16:30

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
The MiG-21 was Bison, ie. with upgraded avionics to pretty modern standards. So not a looser as it may seem.
The exchange of fire was more less as follows. PAF performed an attack on targets behind LOC in Kashmir. IAF scarmbled to intercept the formation and G/C Varthaman went too deep into enemy territory and was downed by F-16. Fortunately he ejected, was a little mauled by locals before rescued by the Pak Army, got a cuppa and few days later was returned. Few weeks later it was claimed by India that G/C Varthaman shot down an F-16 before he was downed himself. Radar screens were produced to substantiate the claim but Lockheed denied any F-16 being lost (they have them under control). Actually no evidence that G/C Varthaman ever managed to fire at anything. On the opposite there was a PAF claim for Su-35, also unsubstantiated.
I know nothing about Atlantic incident.
MiG-21s are operated by few air forces, so there are very slim chances for the type to score again.

Stig Jarlevik 3rd August 2022 17:11

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Thanks for the explanation Franek

Cheers
Stig

GoranA 3rd August 2022 21:48

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
If we ignore (yet) unsubstantiated Varthaman claim and consider 100% confirmed Atlantique from 1999 as the last, that would make 33 years span for MiG-21 (there is also even more dubious Syrian claim from 1964 for Israeli Mystere)

F-16 has 39 years between Rafi Berkovich' Mi-8 over Zahle in April '81 and Syrian L-39 over Idlib in March 2020, shot down by Turkish AF


What about geographical distribution of scoring? Are F-16, MiG-21 and Mirage F-1 the only airplanes with shotdowns over 3 continents, or are there any other candidates?

knusel 3rd August 2022 22:26

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Good evening Gentlemen,

very interesting.
Can you tell me names of the pilots who shot down the Atlantic in 1999 or the Syrian L-39 in 2020 ?

The P-38 scored above 5 continents:
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...ight=continent
The P-40, too:
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showth...ll+p-40&page=2

Cheers,


Michael

GoranA 4th August 2022 01:54

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Ok , I was thinking about post WW2, but still good to know :)...


Regarding 1999 Atlantique shot down - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prashant_Kumar_Bundela

For the turkish victory much less is known, which is logical, considering that it is an ongoing conflict and the pilot is still in service (some hints that aircraft was from 192 filo). More is known about the victim - crew members were Major Hussam Mayhoub (KIA) and Col. Ammar al-Boodi (rescued)

knusel 4th August 2022 15:42

Re: The Mikoyan-Gurevich MiG-21 - the utmost longevity of scoring
 
Hello Goran,

I've found the following entry for the first MiG-21 kill:
https://warisboring.com/in-1964-the-...n-oil-company/

Can you tell me if the dubious Syrian claim from 1964 for an Israeli Mystere was earlier ?

Have a nice Thursday,

Michael


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