Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

Hello,

The insignias of 2 and 3 Staffel on Ju87Bs of I./StG77 have been published in the literature since the 1960s. However, finding confirming evidence in photos from the spring of 1940, when aircraft were clearly using Staffel insignias on their aircraft, has been difficult. For 1 Staffel, there is no problem, as the "lucky pig" design is well established in photos. However, 2 Staffel aircraft are supposed to carry a rearing elephant, but a/c apparently with that unit do not clearly show a design that shows the reported design. Shapes are just not right, although there is no question that the elephant design was used sometime in the unit's history. A similar problem exists with 3 Staffel aircraft. Does anyone have any certain photo images from the May-June, 1940 period, or earlier, that clearly show the reported images of the elephant and the bird on 2 and 3 Staffel aircraft?

Thanx,

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

The only 2./StG. 77 elephant photo of is in the Airdoc book, sadly no codes but the emblem is undoubtably StG. 77:

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

This particular photo (or a copy) was sold on eBay yesterday.

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

Larry,
Check the Stuka photos you have from my collection. Nearly all of them are from Aretz and Elfner, who were with 3./St.G. 77 before 2./210. You may strike lucky there.

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

John,

Thanks! I'll do that. Chris S. and Denes, thanks for your comments as well. We'll get this resolved. I've another photo showing the elephant, but the problem is that I have several of what I think are 2 Staffel Ju87Bs with rather indistinct squadron insignias that don't appear to have the correct shape for the elephant.

Regards,

Larry

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

Hi Larry

This is a bit off your topic but still within the St.G 77 remit I have, firstly this image with what must be a St.G 77 emblem but do you know which Staffel or Gruppe it belongs?
Second image looks like 8./St.G 77 (bomb in a loop caped with a crown)but the 'loop' seems to have 'arms'.
Lastly third image doesn't resemble any St.G 77 emblem I am familiar with!

AFAIK and looking at camouflage all images taken pre-1940. I hope you or others can help.

Cheers

Chris

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

Hi,

first - 4./StG77
third - 1./StG77

Robert

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

Thank you very much Robert I can see now that both emblems are reversed on the port side so that the head points forward! Simple when you think of it.

Now we need to solve the second! Here is a blow up of the emblem, it does look like 8./St.G 77 but for the 'arms'.

Sorry Larry in hijacking your thread.

Chris

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

Thanks for posting the StG77 emblem picts Chris. Haven't seen some of those before.

Re: Problems with established 2. and 3./StG77 insignia supposedly used during the WC of 1940?
 

The arm on the right side of the figure eight is there, but the crown-like shape above is different from the crown depicted in Ketley & Rolfe. I cannot imagine what the slight mass going along the bottom of the 8 might be. This may be an "early" variant of the emblem.



Ed