Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Hello,

on 21.07.1940 a BF-110 of 4.(F)/ 14 was undertaking a
reconnaissance sortie over south-east England. Over
Old Sarum Oblt. Friedrich-Karl Runde shot down a Hawker
Hart of No. 1 FTS flown by acting-Leading Airman J.A. Steel, RN.
Following this encounter, Runde next engaged a Fairy Battle.
The Battle was forced to make a wheels-up landing, outside
Shrewtown. The BF-110 was then shot down by Hurricane's
of No. 238 Squadron.
My questions:
Knows anybody the serial of the Hawker Hart?
Knows anybody the squadron, crew and Serial of the Battle?
The Battle was a training aircraft.

TIA
fireship

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Hi Fireship

Hart K6485 1FTS Shot down by fighter and crashed Winterbourne Dauntsey, Wilts.

Battle P2272 12OTU crashed in forced landing at Burrow Corner, near Tiverton, Devon, Sub Lt E.A. Moole RN safe

Me 110C 5F+CM 4.(F)/14 shot down by fighters at Goodwood Home Farm, Sussex

Source: Air Britain Crash Sites in the UK during WW Two

Cheers

Stig Jarlevik

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Hello,

Would that be the very same 5F+CM that is for sale on eBay ?

See Ed West's threads .

F/L Turner,F/O Davis and P/O Wigglesworth each a third.

Alex

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

The Hart serial is correct but the Battle crash-landed at Shrewton being flowen by Flt Lt John Wray. The story is in my book'The Luftwaffe's Battle of Britain: The Bombers Battle'

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

...oh and the Hart's pilot was John Arthur Seed not Steel. Somewhere John Wray gave me his Battle's serial number

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

...which was P6616 and his pupil was a Lt Churchill

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Ahhh
So we are talking about two totally different Battles then. P2272 was deff LOST on the 21st, while P6616 obviously must have been repaired since it was officially SOC in Aug 1942 becoming a maintenance airframe 3312M.

I guess that is the danger of sitting way off center of things... :-)

Cheers
Stig Jarlevik

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Wiltshire to Devon to Sussex doesn't seem a terribly sensible route - geography suggests that the two Wiltshire crashes should be credited to the 110 and the Devon crash is a separate event. But you've probably worked that out already.....

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Hi Stan and the others,

many thanks for the info's

Regards
fireship

Re: Hawker Hart shot down on 21.07.1940
 

Here's another one for the Battle of Britain experts. Following the disastrous 16 August 1940 raid on Brize Norton, flying instructors based there with 2FTS formed an unofficial ad hoc Station Defence Flight using Spitfires from 10MU. According to one instructor, the flight claimed four victories before the powers-that-be put a stop to the 'private' air force! AHB have no information on this unit, so over to you Chris and Peter and others!

Brian