Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

The (long) title is self-explaining, but I would like to detail it even more.

Are there any expert, historian or researcher dealing with the units in the title which could shed a little light and thus confirm or deny the presence and role of Italian fighters operating as escorts to these units in November-December 1943 against enemy convoys in the Dodecanese...?

Even the smallest clue would be welcome, but official sources are of course preferred.

Thanks in advance

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

Hello veltro!

Maybe you should find Byron in here and send him a pm. He has written a fantastic book on Luftwaffe in Greece, so maybe he can help you.
Best of luck!!

Christian

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

Hi again Ferdinado

This is what I have written, the details extracted from THE ARMED ROVERS by Roy C. Nesbit. I have yet to check the relevant ORBs, but I assume Nesbit had. Nothing conclusive, but .....

"Later in the afternoon [of 30 October 1943]14 Ju88s of Einsatz Gr.Ju88 Gen d.FlAus 6, escorted by six Bf109s from 9./JG27 and an three MC202s approached the task force [HMS Aurora and her escort], which now had an escort of three Beaus from 227 Squadron and two more from 252 Squadron. The fighters engaged the 252 Beaus, Sgt E.H. Jones’ aircraft surviving a head-on attack by a Messerschmitt, while Flt Sgt F.A. Stanger RAAF reported being attacked from astern by a Macchi, which shot away his rudder fabric before being chased away by Jones."

Cheers
Brian

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

Many thanks Brian. This is a very interesting additional piece of the puzzle.

Nevertheless it relies on visual ID during combat, whose reliability is still open to debate.

I guess that some clues from German side (at this point including also III./JG 27) would be what is still needed.

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

"14 Ju88s of Einsatz Gr.Ju88 Gen d.FlAus 6" - if this was taken verbatim from Nesbit, then he did not get it from a German source and this makes it suspect. It should read: "14 Ju 88s of Einsatzgruppe Ju 88/General der Fliegerausbildungs". Correctly abbreviated it would be: "14 Ju 88s of Eins.Gr. Ju 88/Gen.d.Fl.Ausb.".

As for the Macchi fighters, I have been all over that area using all the microfilmed German reports and KTB material from Heeresgruppe E, all of the German units histories for JG 27 and KG 6 (yes, there is a manuscript unit history for KG 6), plus many of the XII Bomber Command and from 1 November 15th AAF sitreps and opsums. I do not recall seeing any reference to Italian fighters being used to escort German bombers in the eastern Aegean. On 30 October 1943, III./JG 27 was at Athens-Kalamaki being used for the escort duties described while IV./JG 27 was at Podgorica in Montenegro and Tirana/Albania operating over the Dalmatian coast.

This sounds very much like something taken from an RAF after action report that contains some enemy aircraft misidentifications. Since I certainly could be wrong due to missing something, someone independent of me should check Jochen Prien's multi-volume history of JG 27 that covers the dates in question. If the Italian fighters participated in that escort mission, then Prien would have mention of it. Another good source would be our member "Byron" from Greece who has covered all of the material I did plus even more.

Larry

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

Hello Veltro, hello old friends,

I really never heard about a participation of italian planes during the battle of Dodecanes. There is nothing about it in all wardiaries of "Heersgruppe E" or "Militärbefehlshaber Griechenland".
Units of KG 54 were on greek soil only in the second half of 1942, i have no info about them over Dodekanes.
IV./JG 27 left Greece 21.10.43 to Podgorica and Tirana but came back middle November and took part by the operations there.

These are the units with intervention at this region:

Einsatz Staffel KG 100, 5./KG 100 (Gleitbombenstaffel), III. and IV./JG 27, 11./ZG 26, II./KG 51, I. u. II./St.G. 3, Chef-A.W.-Gruppe, 3./LG 1. , III./LG 1, II./KG 6.
For transport were angaged 2. u. 6./TG 4, parts of 1./TG 2 and parts of II./TG 2.
For reco 2./SAGr. 125 and SAGr. 126

regards
byron

Re: Greece, November 1943. II./KG 54, II./KG 6 and, I./St.G. 3. Any data confirming escort of Italian fighters...?
 

Hi, Byron.

Thanks a lot for your precious contribute, which enforces further my sensations...

It seems that we are well on the way to exclude any operations of Italian fighters in that area after the Armistice of Sept. 8, 1943. This would be coherent to what happened in the Aegean islands after that date.

At the same time this cannot exclude that single or groups of volunteer Italian pilots/military did join the Germans and were eventually put into service - on German planes.

This not to sustain what reported (based only on oral memories of a single person) in the text of Vigna, but rather to try to explain the loss of Serg. Sancristoforo apparently in action.

So far, this is the best explaination I'm able to formulate...