Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

Hello,

many years I have collected and research the Hungarian Flying history. (My grandfather was a pilot in WWII in the Hungarian airforce).
Now I would like to ask some Luftwaffe expert to clear out this question. I found two different source about the 4pcs. Hungarian Ju 188D-1 Long reconnaissance plane from Hungarian Wings yearbook. Both of them are different.

1) From Franz A Vajda: December of 1944 the Hungarians ordered 4pc Ju 188D-1 and three replacement Jumo motors. Junkers permit higher authority. 12th January 1945 rejected the request to the RDL. What is not clear from the documents that the Hungarian Ministry of Defence turned immediately turn through Füterer to Air Marshall Göring.
However, it is shown in the document, that on 14 January the Oberbefehlshaber der Luftwaffe, Hermann Göring therefore left the machines and engines are delivered from 15 January.
This document show Ju 188D-1 WNr production numbers /0576, 0580, 0583, 0601/ and the type of engines Jumo 213A-1 /103856, 103861, 103872/ (marked by red square). It is could be the German delivery from they equipment or its certified reserves offered. The Generalquartiermeister - as is also the case file – 25 January 1945, closed the file, so the machines have been delivered.
Possible delivery location Érsekújvár (Novy Zámky) or Wiener-Neustadt. It is not clear yet.

2) From Janos A Peterdi F.Lt „Finally, four Hungarians Ju-188 got for the allocation of the paper only. In reality, the machine has not been received.
Maybe it was the Germans intend to allocate a Ju-188 for the Hungarians, but this was never carried out not because the war intervened.”

Somebody have different souce or other info about the above mentioned text? Was this WNr numbers in Dessau? Could be the Jumo engine number?
I did not find other info above:
http://hugojunkers.pytalhost.com/ju_home.htm; http://hugojunkers.pytalhost.com/ju_jumo213_a1.htm
Jumo Produktion Figures: http://hugojunkers.pytalhost.com/ju_jumo213_p1.htm

Waiting for a replay.
Best regards,

Balazs Garai

Re: Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

Hello

I forgot to attach the documents

Best regards,

Balazs Garai

Re: Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

I attached

Re: Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

Balázs,

Only Ferenc Antal Vajda and me visited and researched the BA-MA for Hungarian aviation materials. (I spent three months in Freiburg in 2004 and I have spent decades in Hungarian military and government archives as well, looking for the same stuff.)

This document is very interesting (like some of his other findings), but nothing remained in Hungarian documents about the actual delivery nor the actual using of the type (the crews did not remember this, either). This period is even more hazy, than the 1939-1944 (acute lack of sources).

There were many interesting promises by Luftwaffe to the RHAF for 1945, but these remained generally just promises, because of the collapse.

Incidentally the sources about Ju 188's in the RHAF's inventory in 1943 (which is the other case) are erroneous, these were in fact Ju 88 D-5s (I have at least one WNr as well).

Re: Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

Hello,

Interesting document. This is a typical reply to a release (Freigabe) request, in other words an application for a permit to make delivery, and in this case the answer was negative on 12 January 1945. This decision seems to have been changed on 15 January, some of the text has been crosed out and the c/ns and "vom 15.1.45 freigegeben" has been added to the document. However, this only means that delivery was permitted, not that it actually happened.

Lennart Andersson

Re: Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

Hello Garai,

Your most interesting document raises several questions.

First, the four Ju188D-2 Werknummern in your document are possibly incomplete. My guess is that they would each be preceded by the numerals “15,” making them, 150576, 150580, 150585, and 150601. As such, they would fall nicely within known Siebel Ju188D-2 Werknummern. I am certain that one of our Ju88/188 experts will correct me if I am wrong.

My second question concerns the three Jumo 213A-1 Werknummern in your document: 103856, 103861, and 103872. None of the 183 entries in my Jumo213 database file take this form. Every 213A-1 in my file starts with a three digit number that indicates the maker (100 and 102 = Jumo-Köthen; 106 = Mittledeutsche-Leipzig; or 111 = unknown maker). This is followed by the numerals, “152,” and finally, a four-digit Werknummer. Typical examples would be: 1001520019, 1021520345, 1061521401, and 1111523825.

Any corrections or clarifications will be greatly appreciated.

Steve Sheflin,

Re: Hungarian mysterious Ju 188D-1 reconnaissance plane question
 

Hello Csaba, Steve and Lennart,

thanks for a replay. All information were meaningful. I hope soon as later will turn up new details or pictures about this planes.

Thanks. Best regards,

Balazs Garai