Fighter or Flak
 

On 29 April 1944 RAF Sqd. 132 was flying a Ranger patrol of six
Spitfire IXs led by Sqd. Ldr. Geoffrey Page over Holland. They
encountered a Bf 110G-4 night fighter flown by Hptm. Hans-Joachim
Jabs over Deelen. Upon return to base there were two Spitfires missing.
Both of these Spitfires are listed in RAF Fighter Command Losses Vol. 3 by
Norman Franks as having been shot down by flak, with the additional
note that Jabs claimed two Spitfires.

The questions I have are: Did the returning Spitfire pilots attribute
the two losses as to having been shot down by flak? Did any of these
pilots actually witness the loss of either Spitfire? Did they see any
flak bursts? Were any claims submitted by the German flak at this
airfield? Did they even open fire? Did Jabs state that flak guns
were also firing at the Spitfires?

I believe that John Coulton, the surviving pilot, stated that he had
been shot down by Jabs and the two pilots met at Deelen airfield and
corresponded with each other after the war. Geoffrey Page wrote the
book, Tale of a Guinea Pig, in 1981 but he fails to mention this
combat. Did the pride of Page prevent him from mentioning this combat
where six Spitfires against one Bf 110G lost two of their number.
Page also claimed Jabs' fighter. Was the Bf 110G destroyed or just
damaged and to what degree? Was it destroyed after it had landed?
Did the Bf 110 land wheels up or down?

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

This fight is described in page 277 of 'Fighter Command War Diaries , Volume Four' by Foreman, and no Flak fire is described, but as the fight took place over Deelen airfield, it is probable that Flak opened fire, but also probably after Jabs nightfighter had belly-landed, and both RAF fighters had been shot down before by Jabs.

Apparently Jabs and crew escaped injury so there is tittle chance the loss or damage of the aircraft will be recorded in surviving official documents. There is nothing for this date in Michael Balss book 'Nachtjagd Materialverluste'.

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

Ab A. jansen described this event in one of his books "sporen aan de Hemel"or "Wespennest Leeuwarden". There is a picture of Jabs and Caulton together, his crash-landed spitfire and a picture of a written statement that Caulton had to be treated well, signed by Jabs. Caulton and Jabs met again years after the war. I believe that both Spitfires were shot down by Jabs. Remember that he had been a succesfull zerstorer pilot during the Battle of Britain.
Ill look it up when I'm home.

Dennis

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

in "die deutsche Nachtjagd" von Held und Nauroth is a copy of a newspaper (I don't remember which newspaper) with photos of one of the british pilot downed by Jabs and a description of the combat.
Jabs downed both Spitfire IX and then runs to his airport followed by the remaining Spitfire, then flak opended fire to cover the damaged Me 110 landing.

Alessandro

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

Hi.

Apparently Stab/N.J.G.1 lost two aircraft this day, one damaged below 50%, one damaged more than 50%.

No personnel injuries, so there would be no NVM that cover this incident. But as the other poster has stated, it seems that the brits themselves considered both Spits had been shot down by Jabs.

Regards,
Andreas

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

Hi Andreas,

What is your source, please ?

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

Hi, Laurent.

My source are Summarische Verlustemeldungen, Stab/N.J.G.1.

I also made a small error, as both these aircraft were damaged (thus estimated as below 50%) by gunfire from enemy aircraft (Bordwaffenbeschuss), one with and one without so-called Feindbeobachtung.

The loss would have been in the GenQu report of 5.5.1944 and 11.5.1944 respectively, too bad these are not available from any source as of yet.

Regards,
Andreas

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

From”Wespennest Leeuwarden, part 3”by A.A. Jansen, ISBN: 90 6045 142 2, page 206-213
Major Jabs had been on an inspection of the III gruppe at St. Trond. During this daylight flight his other crewman were; bordfunker Lt.Erich Weisseflog and bordschutze Ofw. Johann Poppelmeyer. While over Nijmegen he saw several German fighters circling Fl.Pl. Deelen. Suddenly he identified 8 of them as Spitfires and they were attacking him. He was barely able to evade a stream of cannon fire. When the spitfires regrouped he decided that an attack was the best defence. He pointed his nose at the nearest Spitfire an fired. It caused F/O John Caulton to crash-land his Spitfire FF-G, MK639 in a nearby field. Jabs’s manoeuvre has frustrated the attack and the spitfires regrouped again. Jabs used the opportunity to head at full throttle toward the fliegerhors for a fast landing. The Spit’s were however to fast an again Jabs had to turn an fight. Again this manoeuvre surprised the Spit’s. He fired at a turning Spit which went down as well. P/O Pullin tried to crash-land but failed and died near Beekbergen. His own machine was now riddled with bullets, had one smoking engine and had several large holes in the wings.
Again he tried to land. As soon as the wheels touched the runway he shouted to his men to get out. While they were runnin towards a trench the Spitfires shot up the Me110.

F/O Caulton (RNZAF)was only lightly wounded. And spend some time at Deelen. He received a note with instructions to treat him well.
In 1970 Jabs received a letter from Caulton, who had heard that he was still alive. In 1972 they met in Lüdenscheid.

No details on Jabs's Me110 and a Flak responce.

Dennis

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

The story of Caulton can be found on
www.nzfpm.co.nz/fragment/fot_oeaf.htm

Re: Fighter or Flak
 

Sorry.
The address should read:
www.nzfpm.co.nz/fragments/fot_oeaf.htm