Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Hi,

Was there a Fairy Battle shot down at a place called Ernsdorf, which might be in Luxembourg, on 11.5.40? Any particulars?

Thanx,

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Hi Larry,

This is your man - happy bidding ! 10 May 1940 is the correct date.

226 SQUADRON, REIMS-CHAMPAGNE

Battle K9183. Hit by ground fire during dive-bombing of enemy columns between Wallendorf and Diekirch and crashed at Hirzenhaff Farm, south of Bettendorf, 6.30 p.m. Flying Officer D. A. Cameron died of wounds in Diekirch hospital May 13. Sergeant C. S. Hart captured unhurt. AC1 J. G. Ward captured slightly wounded. Aircraft MQ*R a write-off.

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Hallo Peter

I have no particular reason to disbelieve your details, but in the past (the books Valiant Wings by Norman Franks and Blitzed by Victor Bingham) K9183 has been indentified as lost on this mission with F/Lt Kerridge at the controls, while L5247 is identified as the one flown by Cameron.

Supposing you are correct, what is your source and do we have an explanation why the two other authors made their cross identification mistake?

Since you are quoting the aeroplanes code you are perhaps looking at a place they failed to look at?

Cheers
Stig

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Hello Stig,

Franks & Bingham made no mistake, my own notes confirm that the serials they quote are exactly as they appear in the No. 226 Squadron ORB - I guess the real question is why then did I chose to transpose them ?

In short, it was on the advice of a well-known researcher whose opinion I have come to respect & trust over the years, & indeed still do. It is also possible that I may have been further persuaded by Gillet's 'Rupture' - a book I value but which, I now recognise, may have been influenced by the same source.

However, take a look at eBay Item 180090688668 and let me know what you think. Despite what appears to be a prominent letter 'K' on the top of the rudder where the serial often appeared I freely admit that I can make out (or think I can) L5247 on the rear fuselage much better than I can K9183. Maybe somebody with state-of-the-art technology can advise ?

I am very happy to be shown to be wrong (again) - as always, my only concern being to document things as accurately as possible.

Thanks for your question.

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Peter Cornwell,

I know you from ZERSTORER book and admires your work. I entered this querie just for curiosity. Your last answer touched me quite a lot...I feel mankind is lacking this kind of relationship, honesty to admit our own errors and be glad to adquire further knowledges.
Please, excuse me for interrupting the Historical chain of information, but I will read you with other eyes now and much more respect ( Human and Historical respect ).
Sincerely yours

An admirer

Adriano Baumgartner

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Adriano,

Thank you for your comments - I am humbled.

Hopefully, someone with photo-enhancing software will soon provide us with a conclusive answer to the question.

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Hallo Peter

I must I admit I hate to be a pain in a most prominent place of yours...:)

However I fail to see the connection, perhaps because I don't have full details. I DID look at the gruesome photos (thanks Ed) at the time, but I myself am at a total loss to make out ANY serialnumber in these photos plus the distressing fact that the photos state 11.5.1940 and not 10.5.1940. That of course can be a mistake from the individual who wrote the text on the backside.

Unless of course you can ID the wounded/dying airmen in the photo(s) the only useful item we actually have is the letter R on the Battle a place name and the date 11.5.1940.

The two books I have are of course not very exact in detail as regard to the exact spot each Battle fell that day, so I can only assume you have more detailed info in the checked loss reports of WHERE these Battles were shot down/went missing, but since the two young crews most certainly was on the same mission and succumed more or less on the same time they surely fell quite close?

From my point of view, I fell you gallop ahead of me here, and just perhaps are jumping to conclusions. I don't know to be honest, but as a side note, I am sorry I started this thread since looking again at the photos the futillity of war and all the needless sacrifices the European youth had to make in the face of political follies makes the chasing of which individual who was in which Battle rather crumble into ashes....:cry:

All the Best
Stig

Re: Fairy Battle loss on 11.5.40?
 

Hello Stig,

The connection you seek is in the location quoted compared to recorded losses. These being for No.226 Squadron on that mission:

226 SQUADRON, REIMS-CHAMPAGNE

Battle (K9183). Hit by ground fire during dive-bombing of enemy columns between Wallendorf and Diekirch and crashed at Hirzenhaff Farm, south of Bettendorf, 6.30 p.m. Flying Officer D. A. Cameron died of wounds in Diekirch hospital May 13. Sergeant C. S. Hart captured unhurt. AC1 J. G. Ward captured slightly wounded. Aircraft MQ*R a write-off.

Battle (L5247). Shot down ground fire during dive-bombing attack on enemy columns between Wallendorf and Diekirch and crashed in the northern suburbs at Faubourg de Luxembourg, Weimerskirch 6.30 p.m. Flight Lieutenant B. R. Kerridge captured badly wounded, died May 15. Corporal G. H. Dixon captured badly burned. Sergeant D. I. Anthony captured unhurt. Aircraft a write-off.

Battle P2180. Returned damaged by ground fire during dive-bombing attack on enemy columns between Wallendorf and Diekirch 6.20 p.m. Sergeant H. J. Barron wounded in left leg. Sergeant D. E. Bingham and Corporal L. Smith unhurt. Aircraft damaged but repairable - destroyed on evacuation 16 May.

Believe me, a serial number is on the rear fuselage but I accept that it is difficult to make out - the starboard side view being best. Also, in my experience, photo captions are best treated with caution inevitably being subject to the vagaries of human memory.

Recognising that the two books you have lack the necessary detail to make any proper judgement, you must be correct to assume that I have more detailed information. Forty or more years research has its compensations I guess. And as you volunteer the fact that you 'don't know' I should tell you that while I often reach conclusions it is generally via a fairly cautious and deliberate process - at my age I rarely 'jump'.

Finally, don't be too dispirited for you didn't start this thread, I replied to a query from Larry Hickey. I am also at odds with your final comments believing, as I do, that it is important to document these events as accurately as possible. We owe them that much.