[Marius]

Hi all,
as I see our Polish contingent is not very helpful. And apparently a serious argumentation based on serious documents is not needed. They just "know it better".


[Find it yourself...
I do not know if he is alive but certainly his comments were published in the German press of 1960s.]


A question to Franek:

Do you like to play cat and mouse? I thought you are talking about something what you can prove, what you have at hand. But apparently you don`t.
As you should know Germany was divided into West and East. In East Germany were acting authors and journalists who had to keep one`s (visible) distance from the III Reich period and the bad things done by Hitler and his fellows. The true (East) Germany was changed. Russia was than (officially) the best friend.
So if you are talking about German press of 1960s perhaps you could specify it? Published in East or West? Who was the author of the article? Where shall I look for it?

And one more thing Franek. Nobody denies here holocaust or other German war crimes (were it is obvious). Your attempt to turn away from the crux of this discussion will not be succesful.
But when you are talking about German war crimes you have also to talk about war crimes done for example by Polish butchers. You are writing Germans did many bad things. And you are surely right, nobody is denying this. But how many bad things did Poles in September 1939 already? You cannot compare these things because all the world is focussed on the German war crimes only. You are doing the same (for example your comments concerning Bromberg are very onesided - of course Germans were guilt, for you there is no other possibility. But nevertheless Bromberg is not the only one place where Poles killed German civilians, right?).

In one more point you are right. Hitler started the war and then happenend many bad things, many civilians were killed. But this fact isn`t giving you the right to make Germans also responsible for war crimes done by others.
Franek, I cannot kill my German neighbour, because a German killed my wife. In such a case I am making myself to a murderer what has to be punished in a court.


Don`t forget we are searching here for a hard proof of intended bombing of civilian targets. How the civilians itself saw the falling bombs and what they feeled shouldn`t be the decisive factor to make such easy statements that by bombing targets only the killing of civilians was intended.
You cannot demonstate German intention only showing graves of killed civilians, photos of destroyed places or simply onesided afterwar propaganda.

Maybe there were no Polish troops in Frampol on the 13th or in Wielun on the 1th. But nevertheless how can you deny that Luftwaffe crews wanted to hit Polish troops? If they in fact only hit civilians I would call it a mistake, not wanted. You call it a "war crime" and you have absolutely no problem doing this. You mean the intention is not needed (or you assume it is automatically existing) and here you are completely wrong.

Marius