[HGabor]

Guys, as I am having the list of Soviet AC losses in Hungary in 1944-45 (5 and 17 VA by units, dates & locations, aircraft and AC engine serial numbers, markings and crew name(s) from TsAMO archives, Russia) I had the opportunity to compare the facts to German and Hungarian claims. It is true, German statistics have never been in the centre of my research, but I should say (please forgive me) that eg. Hartmann's claims (at least in this time period) are very 'shaky' and in most cases I would NOT put my money down on their credibility. But eg. Hptm. Helmut Lipfert's claims are pretty much accurate, I was able to verify most of them from the soviet loss reports, eg.:

Claim No............Destroyed AC: ............S/N:................Crew:

161. ................Pe-2...........................6/235 .............(3 KIA, Elohov's crew)
172. ................La-5FN....................... 39211399.........(1 KIA, Suhorukhov)
173. ................A-20B........................ 41-2937.......... (4 KIA, Vetlov's crew)
174. ................A-20G.........................43-21588.........(4 KIA, Kruglov's crew)
190. ................IL-2m3 .......................11082..............(2 WIA, Taranovich's crew)
191. ................IL-2m3........................1871797...........(2 KIA, Belyashin's crew)


In my opinion Hartmann's (especially Yak-) claims in most cases were only damaged, but not destroyed.
His 453 BAP Boston claim eg. on November 17, 1944 (S/N: 42-53956 - Danielyan crew) mentioned here by Nokose colleauge as well, was max. a shared victory with Hungarian Capt. Pottyondy Laszlo, but it rather looks that it was Pottyondy's claim, not his... The other A-20G loss on November 17 was also a 453 BAP plane, but in a landing accident during relocation, not combat loss. (S/N: 42-54223, Yurchenko crew. Engines: 42-154065, 42-154199). (No more Bostons on November 17, 1944 in 5 VA.)

On December 14, 1944 17 VA eg. lost 6 IL-2s (S/N: 11429, 11550, 11551, 11553, 11565 and 18862106, plus 7 damaged) as opposed to the 8 German-Hungarian air-, and AAA claims. (No.11551 -from Zavod 1., Kuybishev- is now on display in the Szolnok Aircraft Museum, Hu. It was recovered from Lake Balaton still in 1999. A wingtip of Lipfert's Pe-2 claim from Lake Balaton is also on display in the Museum. Both planes were found in the East-end of the lake near Balatonkenese.)

Gabor