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Old 7th January 2024, 11:03
Stig Jarlevik Stig Jarlevik is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 5,858
Stig Jarlevik will become famous soon enough
Re: WW2TV Horvath lecture/presentation

So did I, even if I usually take a more lenient view regarding claims vs victories.
Always nice to put a face to a text since I have your book, Just wished Gabor
would have dared to show his....
May I also commend your for an excellent English. Very important in a presentation like this!

As I see it, the Luftwaffe verification system during 1939-45 was basically a modified WW 1
system. Not strange since basically all the top brass was individuals from that war.

The system itself fell apart very rapidly. During BoB for instance there were no way
anyone could verify claims over Britain or the Channel, so what was left was to either trust
what the pilots and their back ups said when getting back or not. It was either that or
you would basically have say to the only arm actually fighting the war, we don't trust you!
Since nobody was prepared to do that, the fighting over enemy territory became their
first exception. Now as soon as you are prepared to accept exceptions, you immediately
become prone to pressure from within to accept exceptions elsewhere.

The British came up with a quite genius idea during WW 1, the so called OOC (out of control)
system. Unfortunately historians have interpreted all OOC claims as a officially verified
victories, which they were not!
Also unfortunately the Germans did not come up with a similar system during WW 2.

With regard to Erich Hartmann I believe he was the equivalent of the Canadian Billy
Bishop during WW 1. The "kid who couldn't miss". While Germany more and more rapidly
went downhill, the state and PR machine needed someone who went uphill.
Hartmann fitted that bill perfectly. Young - blond - handsome - daring, you name it.
In other words a perfect National Socialist raw model, this time not on posters, but
in real life. Probably a good choice since his myth still lives on today.

Very little has been said about Hartmann's post war career. As far as I know nobody from his
old unit ever said anything bad about him. He never reached any higher rank in the new Luftwaffe,
Oberst I think, and that was that. Not even after his early death did anyone (as far as I know)
speak up about him. Out of pity? Never "kill" a legend? No idea.
But he is interesting, even to me (my interest is focused on aircraft) since it shows what one
can achieve with a propaganda machine in full swing.
It is still done today in Social Media day after day with an Industry always ready to support
an "influencer".
The less I say about the latter phenomena the better, since I would probably be banned
from TOCH forever.....

Thanks again Daniel
Cheers
Stig
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