[Smith]

Originally Posted by M sIMPSON

According to Middlebrook, only two of 5 Groups aircraft bombed early,so your uncle's aircraft was probably over the target somewhere between 00.43 and 00.55,British time.
The site of the crash,Anklam-Lassen, is about 50 km south of Peenemunde.

Here is a summary of what I know regarding the loss of Lancaster EE147, PG-P of 619 squadron during the Peenemünde raid of 17/18 August 1943.

My Uncle, F/sgt L F English RNZAF (rear gunner) and his fellow crew (F/O O’Leary RCAF pilot) lost their lives when their aircraft was shot down in the immediate vicinity of Peenemünde that night.

As I’m sure many of you know, Martin Middlebrook wrote a well received book about this raid and in it he alleges that this aircraft was 29th down, about 30 kms south of the target near Anklam. Mark Simpson refers to this in his post above. Middlebrook is unable to identify what combat resulted in the loss of EE-147.

My conjecture is that this is because he has the wrong location.

We (family) have a copy of an MRES report that identifies another location for the crash. Casualty Enquiry No. G 61, 20 Sept 1945, states inter alia: "According to German documents now in our possession the aircraft crashed 2 kms. north of ZECHERIN and 200 metres from PEENEMÜNDE on the night of 17th/18th August, 1943." BTW I don’t have copies or even references for those original German documents, they may be KE reports.
http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showpo...63&postcount=9

The breakthrough for me was the wonder of multimap.com. If you look at this location query on multimap
http://www.multimap.com/maps/#t=l&map=53.96792,13.71721|11|4&hloc=DE|zecherin
you can see that there are TWO places named “Zecherin” and I think this is what has lead Middlebrook astray.

One is near Anklam (ie. where Middlebrook suggests) but in no way coincides with the very specific location given by the MRES. The other Zecherin however, is not far south of Peenemunde. Although "2km north of Zecherin" and "200 metres from Peenemunde" does not necessarily make sense if it refers to the town of Peenemunde, which is clearly more than 2km north of the more northerly Zecherin … if it meant 200m from the banks of the river, interpreting Peenemunde as "the mouth of the river Peene", rather than the town, it makes a lot of sense.

That would put the location of the crash SSW of Karlshagen, itself a little south of the (scientist’s) housing estate and the workers camp, both a handful of kilometres south of the rocket facilities, and very much part of the target area. This argues that EE-147 was shot down in the immediate vicinity of the target, either an interception by a night-fighter right over the target (and this did happen) or the aircraft may have been hit by flak over the target and then crashed not long after. Bear in mind the attack was low level, between 5000 and 8000 feet (not metres).

When? Well so far all we know is that 619 squadron, a member of 5 Group, bombed in the last wave of the attack, in part utilising the time-and-distance bombing method. Again, Mark (posting above) quotes Middlebrook as saying the third wave bombed between 00:43am to 00:55am "Britsih Time" I believe the "local" time was one hour later.

I've have a download of Tony Woods' ReichWest claims and there are 17 claims between 1:40am and 2:00am at or near Peenemunde (and more either side of that time-slot). Is there any practical way to weed through them all?

One thing I will do ~ I have been to the library this morning and borrowed Middlebrook's book. He discusses the air battle over the target and includes some personal recollections of Luftwaffe pilots with comments like "the aircraft fell into the sea" and so on. This will rule some out.

And of course, if we are able to narrow the timeslot at all we could perhaps narrow the field. I still wonder if we could establish "time up" or similar for EE-147 and maybe compare that with other aircraft over the target area. Bit of a long shot I know.

Many thanks for all your help, regards Don