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Old 4th August 2007, 17:38
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Re: Fw 190 A-8, I./JG 301

Some thoughts about JG301 fuselage markings


A/. What we know?

GeschwaderStab probably got a blue horizontal bar. Ok, I know we are not so many to think about that up to now but I m pretty sure Jerry Crandall will confirm this in September in his so awaited books about Fw 190D-9 (see there http://www.eagle-editions.com/dorabook.htm )

For sure the awaited usual JG301 fuselage band with the usual no additional marking behind the fuselage Balkencross for the first group was very rare:
We know Fw190A yellow 17 or blue 7 and Fw190D yellow (or blue?) 15.

On the other side II./JG301 horizontal bar was pretty common and existed at least in white and red, and over Fw190A as well as D9.

III./JG301 markings are pretty unknown.

IV./JG301 markings are also pretty unknown, except from one Bf 109 with an horizontal bar published inside W.Retscke’s book


B/. First explanation: each groups had an horizontal bar fuselage marking with corresponding colour for each groups!

ie: blue for Stab./JG301, white for I./JG301, red for II./JG301, yellow for III./JG301, green for IV./JG301.

(See older post fromDec 2004 there: http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=547&highlight=extraordinary and an update there: http://forum.12oclockhigh.net/showthread.php?t=547&highlight=extraordinary )


C/. Recent evolution:

Now thanks to Steve Sheflin we know for sure from colour pictures that reversed JG301 fuselage band had really existed and so they are not JG5 fuselage band as firstly though from B&W photos. It’s also interesting to note that one of those also show a JG11 emblem on its fuselage side.


D/.New possibilities:

a/ .We not facing I./JG301 airplanes then colour specific horizontal bar for each group hypothesis keep valid.

Argument for I./JG301 don’t got reverse markings and thus that it could be another unit:
- “chevron4” is not the awaited StabI./JG301 marking since GeschwaderStab (Ta152 green 1,2, 3…), Stab II./JG301 (green7 and possibly green 20) and Stab IV./JG301 (green 21) were all using green digits. This chevron like marking is an older kind of markings pretty uncommon in late stage of the war.
- This reversed RV seems to have been found strangely only in South/Central Germany/Europe [ Fürth, Ansbach, Straubing, Langensalza, Czechoslovakia ] when I./JG301 was fighting on the North since end of August 1944 [ Salzwedel, Finsterwalde, Hagenow then Leck ]! ! ! Strange not?
- There is a JG11 emblem visible over one airplane, so those airplanes could have been from I./JG11 instead of JG301. Could have it been temporary JG11 markings? Imho probably not since at Leck surrender it seems that JG11 airplanes simply no more used their JG11 yellow fuselage band.
- The reverse fuselage band thesis destroyed the group color specific horizontal bar theory except if one follow the other in the time. Ok, that not an argument J

In any case this reversed fuselage band doesn’t look as a ‘lazy’ figure painted over JG11 aircraft to me but far more as a voluntary painting used for all the group. Firstly because of its large JG11 yellow fuselage band it is not easier to paint the red one in front than in backward position and secondly if it was, we must have seen more than one or two airplanes with usual JG301 band especially since it seems that when it was disbanded III./JG301 give its Fw190 to I./JG301.

b/. We are facing I./JG301 airplanes,

Argument for I./JG301 got reversed markings:
- It is doubtful that two different units could have used so similar markings
- It seems that I./JG301 veterans remember to have used reversed fuselage marking.
- JG 301 and JG 11 could have kept some relation ship from the time they shared their airplanes for JG301 “wildesaw” experiment?
- Different kinds of I./JG301 markings could have succeeded one to the other in the time, but then in which order?
- Jerry Crandall and David E. Brown are working over JG301 unit and they support this theory.

then there is 2 possibilities:

* The two kinds of markings, white horizontal bar and no bar, succeed one to the other in the time inside I./JG301. The non horizontal bar supposed to be an older markings since all those airplanes had be seen from South or Central Germany or Czechoslovakia when I./JG301 end the war on North Germany. I must say that this thesis stay my favourite one up to now!

*Or both I and II./JG301 aircrafts could have been separated in two sub-groups with different kind of markings inside each sub-group, perhaps to make easiest distinction between their 2 heavies and 2 lights Staffeln or to group together one heavy and one light staffel.

GeschwaderStab > green + blue horizontal bar [see NASM Ta 152 restoration]

I./JG301 Stab > chevron + reversed RV [see chevron4]

1./JG301 > full white + reversed RV [see white 5, Furth?]
2./JG301 > outlined black + reversed RV [see black9 and black 6, Furth?]

3./JG301 > outlined yellow + usual RV [see yellow 17, Czechoslovakia]
4./JG301 > outlined blue + usual RV [see blue 7 and D9 blue or yellow 15, Staubing (or Langensalza?)]


II./JG301 Stab > unknown but possibly green 7 + red horizontal bar [posted on the LEMB from a video tape, unknown place]

5./JG301 > white + red horizontal bar [see white 21 or D9 white 12, Langensalza]
6./JG301 > red + red horizontal bar [see red 22, Langensalza ]

7./JG301 > yellow + white horizontal bar [see yellow 8, Salzwedel ]
8./JG301 > blue + white horizontal bar [see blue? 20 in Barbas book, unknown place]


III./JG301 > was a full heavy group but with unknown markings up to now it was disbanded before the end of war and so there is no photos available.

IV./JG301 > was also disbanded before the war end and only very few photos are available.

Indeed one or 2 photos shows Bf 109G-10 with an horizontal bar but this is perhaps after disbanded IV./JG301 had moved most of her Bf 109 to II./JG301… But since this horizontal bar seems to be from a different tone than the red from the fuselage band, I still think it’s a green one, the one I suppose to be specific from IV./JG301.


E/ Conclusion:

Make your own choice, until we know more… Can’t wait up to September2007… J


Cheers, Olivier.

Last edited by O.Menu; 4th August 2007 at 20:59. Reason: misspelling but not all of them, sorry...
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