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Old 5th January 2020, 14:15
HGabor HGabor is offline
Alter Hase
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
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Re: Hartmann: claims vs. victories

An interesting and very intense day. Too bad, not much details on his claim, only as 'Yak-9'.

337 4.2.1945 - Yak-9 Stab I./JG 53 - OVERCLAIM? - in Veszprém area?

This day the 17 VA (3rd Ukrainian Front), which was operating in the Veszprém - Székesfehérvár - Lake Balaton area lost:

1 A-20G-36-DO 'Boston', downed by Hungarian Bf 109 fighters (17 VA, 244 BAD, 861 BAP, S/N: 43-10075, Lt. Shuvaev crew) near Sárkeresztes, but crashlanded at Zsámbék, Budapest-W.
2 IL-2m3 (951, 989 ShAP, plus a 3rd IL-2m3: No.1874886 was badly damaged, but repaired in 17 VA, 306 ShAD, 672 ShAP.)
3 La-5FNs (two 848 IAP La-5FN in dogfight, one 116 IAP La-5FN in accident, plus two 194 IAD La-5Fs written off (No.39215033, 39215251) as a result of PREV. DAYS'(!) actions.
NO Yak loss this day in 17 VA!!!

(Very intense tank-battle in the Székesfehérvár-N area for the city, dozens of soviet M4A2(76)W Shermans lost in the 3 UF, 1st Guards Mech. Corps to Panther Ausf. Gs of I./Pz.Rgt 24. Desperate street fights in Buda, in the Western, hilly side of Budapest - Citadella and the Royal Castle area.)

17 VA, despite of the very heavy dogfights (eg. on February 4, 1945) in the Székesfehérvár-Csór-Sárkeresztes area, lost only 1 (Tbilisi-built) 659 IAP Yak-3 in dogfight (S/N: 310137) on February 20, 1945 near Baracska in the whole month!!!!! Several Bf 109, Fw 190 claims, but only a single Yak-3 loss in dogfights in the entire month of February... Another Tbilisi-built Yak-3 (also from 659 IAP) went missing (MIA) near Esztergom the day before on a recce. mission on February 19, 1945 due to engine problem. (S/N: 310155, not combat related)


5 VA (2nd Ukrainian Front) was focusing on the Budapest area. On February 4, 1945 they lost:

3 IL-2m3 (130 and 131 GvShAP)
2 La-5FN (92 IAP, 178 GvIAP)
1 La-7FN (179 GvIAP)
2 Yak-9 (31 GvIAP)

Same list by cause:
Flak: 1 IL-2, 2 La-5
Fighter: 1 IL-2, 1 Yak-9
Unknown (MIA): 1 IL-2, 1 Yak-9

(List missed the single La-7 loss, but it was due to flak. La-7FN, S/N: 45210566, hit by flak over Buda, disintegrated in air, while dive-bombing and strafing German defence positions. Gv.Ml.Lt. Lebedev was KIA.)

5 VA, 6 GvIAD, 31 GvIAP Yak-9, S/N: 1515321, lost at 12:50 local at 4500 m, while patrolling at Budapest-W, 5 km. 6 Yaks vs. 8 Bf 109 near Csepel-island, crashlanded at Rákoscsaba. Pilot, Gv.Lt. Ivan Andreevich Yangaev, injured, taken to field-hospital in Isaszeg. His leader, Vidanov was MIA.

5 VA, 6 GvIAD, 31 GvIAP Yak-9, S/N: 2015350, lost at 12:50 local. 6 Yak, supporting soviet troops in Buda, combat with Bf 109. Pilot, Gv.Ml.Lt. Petr Yakovlevich Vidanov was MIA. His wingman, Yangaev crashlanded and got injured.

Without the details of Hartmann's late claims, it is very difficult to compare records.

Gabor
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