Radiator cut-off valves on Bf 109F-K

[Kurfürst]

Hi,

In Prien/Rodeike's excellent Bf 109F-K monography (English edition by Schiffer), it is stated on page 13-14 that the radiator cut off valves were fitted retrofit in 1941, at least in the case of JG 51 and 52 machines; these kits were highly prized and crews rushed for downed planes to save these valves for use in combat worthy aircraft. Then it is noted that they were not fitted to the G-series aircraft.

There seems to be a bit of a contradiction here, as looking through the Bf 109G service and flying manuals, the cut off valves are depicted on the 109G-2, being under the instument panel on both sides, and the instructions also prescribe their use in case of coolant leak. This would point to that the cut off valves were a kind of standard fit on the 109G.

Similiarly, the 'Griff für Kühlerabchaltung' is shown in the 109K Handbuch from October 1944.

So, is this an error in the book, or in the manuals?

[John Beaman]

I would say an error in the manuals. Manuals were far from flawless. For example, the G manuals continued to show the P-6 reversable prop spinner deep into 1944. It was never fitted. Also, because of the above, they continued to show the G series length shorter than it was. Whoever was writing and then reviewing/editing such manuals was asleep at the switch.

[Kurfürst]

Is this possible to check from reports of downed enemy aircraft, field experience reports by the LW. etc?

[harrison987]

Wasn't the cut-off valve in the F only limited to ONE handle cutting of both? And in the G they were seperate left and right?

[Revi16]

Originally Posted by harrison987

Wasn't the cut-off valve in the F only limited to ONE handle cutting of both? And in the G they were seperate left and right?

I don't have a manual in front of me, but if you closed off both radiators the engine would still overheat and sieze. No coolant flow= high temps till something blows, and it would happen rapidly.

I would think 1 valve per side to stop which ever side is leaking.

Regards,
Mike

[Kurfürst]

Originally Posted by harrison987

Wasn't the cut-off valve in the F only limited to ONE handle cutting of both? And in the G they were seperate left and right?

On the 109G (from 109G-2 Handbuch), there are two levers actuting the system for each radiator lines.

[Kurfürst]

Appearantly these kits were still issued in 1945, the following March 1945 report from Mtt AG shows, if I understood it right, that additional 150 cut off valve kits were ordered by 5. Jagddivision.

[Ruy Horta]

Maybe a nice example of practice versus theory?

[Kurfürst]

I am not if this is not a case of exceptions that proves the rule; reading the text of the book, and taking into account that these valves were still fitted in 1945, I tend to believe that this statement was more of an educated guess on part of the authors, based on some reports etc. of aircraft that lacked this feature. Such exceptions are numerous in practice (i.e. some G-14s did not have armor fitted, but these were probably converted from high altitude versions which didn't have armor fitted as opposed to standard fighter versions).

So, I am still puzzled.

[harrison987]

If it helps, I own an Me109G-2 (one of the very early ones) JG5, and it had the shut-off valves. It arrived in Russia, and was immediatly invloved in only 1 sortie beofre being shot down. So for sure it was installed at factory as oppsed to a ground crew installation.

All Me109G's onwards had the 2 shut-off valves, as you can see the handles in many museum examples.

There are many mistakes in Prien/Rodeike's book, so more likely a mistake in the book.

mike