French P47 shot down near Stuttgart on december 26th 1944?

[Flyingkag]

Hey,

do someone have a French P47 shot down (blown in air) in area Böblingen/Stuttgart on december 26th 1944, about 15h15?

I have checked all the MACRs, searching Julius Meimberg's third vicim (P-47s)on that afternoon, and none of them seems correspond with an explosion in air..so that third one P-47 should maybe have been ...french?

Thanks for any possible help.

Best feelings from France,

Mathias

[Leendert]

Matthias,

Closest in your area may be 42-27092 (Lt Joseph R. Paragone) and 42-27165 (Luther R. Rone), both of 324th FG.
They became POW and both a/c came down in the greater Stuttgart area.

But of course you may have checked these already.

Regards,

Leendert

[Flyingkag]

Thanks Leendert,

I had those both as two first victims of Julius, but third and last one stays unknown.

Jule Meimberg was very accurate in his description of his attacks on that fight, and the last P47, attacked by surprise, litteraly explosed on his face, and his Me109 was damaged by the P47 parts as he was passing in the middle of them. His radiator was touched, white smoke pouring out.

So I cannot imagine the US pilot could have bailed out and survive. He just had not seen Jule before being - in one or two second- deadly touched.

That's why I thougt that, if we have no corresponding US pilot, he could have been french?

[Alex Smart]

Hello Matthias & Leendert,
If it is of use this could be the one you seek ?
From the P47 Database
44-20033
Crashed 26/12/44
GC II/3
Pilot: René Fabre (safe).

All the best
Alex

[Flyingkag]

Thanks Alex!

do someone have any idea about the circumstances/time of his probable airfight?

Mathias

[FrankieS]

Epfig/Alsace (F) more than 100 km WSW from Stuttgart though.

[FrankieS]

This is a complete list for 26.12.1944 P-47 losses for North West ETO sorted by serial from excellent website
http://p-47.database.pagesperso-orange.fr

42-26465 P-47D-25-RE 404th 506th 4K-R MACR 11993 - 26/12/44 vers Mechelen (Hol.) - Pilote : Clinton Winters Jr. - KIA - Flak
42-26545 P-47D-25-RE 362nd 379th G8-? MACR 11480 - 26/12/44 vers Vaux-lez-Rosières (Bel.) - Pilote : Berry Chandler - KIA - Flak
42-26664 P-47D-25-RE 371st 405th 8N-P "Snuffy II" MACR 11610 - 26/12/44 vers Haslach (All.) - Pilote : George R. Simmons - POW - Flak
42-27092 P-47D-27-RE 324th 314th 23 MACR 11611 - 26/12/44 vers Unterjettingen (All.) - Pilote : Joseph R. Paragone - WIA & POW - Combat aérien
42-27165 P-47D-27-RE 324th 314th MACR 11612 - 26/12/44 vers Mönchberg (All.) - Pilote : Luther R. Rone - Parachuté & POW - Combat aérien
42-28302 P-47D-26-RA 406th 513th 4P-? "BIG ASS BIRD" MACR 11478 - 26/12/44 vers Chauveheid (Bel.) - Pilote : Alfred McKnight Jr. - POW - Flak
42-28933 P-47D-28-RA 404th 506th 4K-? MACR 11992 - 26/12/44 vers Petergensfeld (Bel.) - Pilote : Robert G. Fenstermacher - KIA - Flak
42-76261 P-47D-15-RE 404th 506th 4K-I Perdu le 26/12/44
44-19963 P-47D-28-RE 78th 56th 82nd ? MX-U puis H ? Pilote : R. Boeckman Crashé le 26/12/44
44-20033 P-47D-28-RE GC II/3 - ? Crashé le 26/12/44 vers Epfig (67) - Pilote : René Fabre - Ok
44-20067 P-47D-28-RE 36th 23rd 7U-? MACR 11956 - 26/12/44 vers Euskirchen (All.) - Pilote : Peter Gagarin - POW - Combat aérien

[Laurent Rizzotti]

From the description you have it is possible that he shot at a P-47, saw a pilot bail out (victory 1 or 2) and then saw later "another P-47", in fact an empty one he allready claimed, fired at it and saw it explode ?

This can be possible if the description of the fight shows no manoeuver by the third P-47. Especially as both 314th FS pilots bailed out.

[Leendert]

It appears there has been a discussion going on back in 2003 as well:
see http://www.lwag.org/forums/archive/i...hp/t-1870.html

Here it emphasizes Meimberg's point of view, but perhaps it contains some useful details.

Regards,

Leendert

[Flyingkag]

Hey guys,

thanks to all of you; very interesting and detailled answers!

It seems that a third one of 314th was touched in airfight and belly landed/crashed on Haguenau airfield after that mission;

it should be "mine" missing one third plane! So the french P47s would not have been involved in that airfight.

Thanks to Phil D. from Belgium for his (allways very) precious help about that question!!!

Mathias