JG 3 on 2.2.41 - Luftwaffe and Allied Air Forces Discussion Forum

cz_raf · #1 2nd March 2007, 10:12

Hi all,

I have read that on this day Hurricanes of No. 1 Sq RAF were in dogfight with 1./JG 3 over Boulogne sur Mer. Some Bf109s were hit, one piloted by Uffz. Müller (??). Can anybody provide me please the total and real losses of Germans and fate of this pilot?

TIA

Pavel

robert · #2 2nd March 2007, 10:45

Hi Pavel,

on this day one Rotte from the 1 staffel was involved in combat with big formation (mission time: 14.10-15.10) of Spitfires and Hurricanes (50-60). The Germans were able to escape, although their planes were damaged (Uffz.Hutter "Rottenfuehrer" returned unharmed, Ofhr.Guenther Poepel was slightly wounded by shrapnels) - J.Prien "Messerschmitt Bf109 im Einsatz bei Stab und I/JG3" page 101
But in loss list one loss appeared:
1/JG3 Ofhr.Guenther Poepel WIA LK with Hurricane, crashed 3km SE of Boulogne, pilot EPJ, Bf109E-8 6384 lost 100%.

Regards

Robert

Andreas Brekken · #3 2nd March 2007, 15:45

Hi.

The loss record is quite laconic, but the damage suggests to me that the pilot in fact parachuted from the aircraft.

http://www.ahs.no/ref_db/lw_loss_pub...?lossid=114293

Best regards,
Andreas

Tomislav Haramincic · #4 2nd March 2007, 19:30

Hi,

I have Obfhr. Günther Pöpel listed under WNr.6386, but I guess this was a typo by me. So WNr.6384 is the right one for Pöpel.

I have another WNr.6384 listed as a 100% loss on the 30.09.40 4./JG53 Uffz. Karl Vogel (KG), Luftkampf - Absturz, vor Beachy Head - 100% ws.3+− (E-1)
Perhaps this is also a typing error. Can someone correct this one.

Thanks,
Tomislav

Andreas Brekken · #5 3rd March 2007, 13:37

Hi.

What are your references for this Tomislav?

I also have this one, with Uffz. Bogel given as pilot (an obvious misspelling).

http://www.ahs.no/ref_db/lw_loss_pub...?lossid=114654

What we should get our hands on then are the Vordruck II or other sources you have Tomislav, at least for the loss of Vogel. The Vordruck II was probably never issued for Pöpel as he returned unharmed, and if it was it has probably been destroyed.

Best regards,
Andreas B

Tomislav Haramincic · #6 3rd March 2007, 21:54

Hello Andreas,

My sources for Uffz. Karl Vogel are the BAMA Gen.Q.M. losses on microfishes (same as your) and supplemented with the work of Dr. Prien. In JFV part 4/II page 236 Vogel's plane is stated to be WNr.6384, and in JFV 4/I page 193 Pöpel's plane is WNr.6386!

Perhaps Jochen himself can help us here further?

best regards,
Tomislav